Eyewitness Confirms: D.C. Cop Freaks Out Over Snowball Fight–Brandishes Gun
According to an eyewitness, a D.C. Police detective (pictured above w/ gun) went nuts after kids pelted his Hummer with snowballs at 14th and U Streets NW this afternoon. The veteran detective got out of his car and eventually grabbed for his gun, displaying it to the crowd. He did not immediately identify himself as a police officer. He calmed down once his fellow uniformed cop arrived. Apparently, someone called 911 to report a man with gun. The snowball fight had been well hyped on Twitter. The news of the incident first broke there. We caught up with an eyewitness moments ago.
Eyewitness Matthew Bradley tells City Desk:
"An hour ago, we showed up to see a snowball fight already in progress. Two factions along 14th Street along the intersection. It was pretty friendly, mostly OK. At one point, there was one interaction with the police that I saw. A cop got stuck in the snow. People stopped and helped him out. A couple moments later, at the intersection, heading west along U was this big maroon Hummer. A small faction of people decided to target it with snowballs. They're throwing snowballs at the Hummer. It turns out the driver of the Hummer is a detective. He gets out. He's waving a walkie talkie. It's not going well. Then he starts waving a gun. He hadn't identified himself at this point. There was a point where things cooled off a bit, more police showed up, and he identified himself at that point. The name was Det. Baylor. My guess was B-A-Y-L-O-R."
"There was a point where it got really tense. The experience for many people was snowball fight kind of fun...and then there's a guy with a gun."
Bradley says he heard that the police were responding to a 911 call for a man with a gun. The detective calmed down once his fellow cops arrived. Bradley says that he thinks the cop was a detective but is not 100 percent sure. D.C. Police later confirm that the gun-waving cop is a veteran detective.
Later in the incident, the detective goes into the crowd and grabs a man who he thinks threw a snowball at him:
Bradley has posted more photos of the entire incident.
A video of the incident made by Chris Strohm shows the aftermath--where the officer admits he pulled his gun out:
Like so many others, Robin Bell heard about the snowball fight at 14th and U Streets NW and decided to go and check it out. He tells City Desk that prior to the incident, a cop car got stuck in the road and everybody stopped the snowball fight and helped the cop get his car out of the snow. "The crowd cheered and everybody was happy," Bell says.
Soon, though, he started hearing people shouting: "Don't bring a gun to a snowball fight!"
"Then I walked over and I saw a police officer brandishing a weapon," Bell says referring to the uniform cop. He says he didn't see the detective brandish his weapon--only the furious aftermath. He says the detective was yelling and "kind of out of control." "It was really strange to see a police officer so upset and angry over what seemed at best a misunderstanding," Bell explains. "At worst, it was some kids throwing a snowball at him."
At one point, Bell says, the detective ran into the crowd and grabbed man whom he thought might have thrown a snowball at him. Bell adds that the detective them put the individual next to his Hummer. Cops grabbed two others. All three were given warnings. "It was ridiculous because everyone was throwing snowballs," Bell says.
Via Twitter:
"Detective Baylor(sp?) hummer get hits by snowballs and he waves a gun around. Cops on radio say Det is being 'blackmailed'"
And later:
Chant from 14 & U snowball fight: "You don't bring a gun to a snowball fight." Banner: "No war but snowball war."
Prince of Petworth reports similar cop scene:
"A reader writes in about the snowball fight at 14th and U. Word on the street is that apparently it started in good fun but then someone hit a Hummer driving by belonging to a police officer and then the reader says multiple patrol cars responded."
D.C. Police Officer at the 3rd District does confirm to City Desk that the police did respond to 14th and U, refused further comment.
An officer tells me that 2D cops responded and that 3D cops assisted on the incident. An official at 2D says that officers did respond to an incident involving snowballs being thrown at a passing vehicle at 14th and U. He stated that he had not heard about an officer waving his gun around. WJLA just posted a story on the incident with video. It appears that the officer merely brandished his gun. Another uniformed officer took out his pistol.
Still not cool.
Assistant Chief Diane Groomes tells LL via e-mail:
"Hello..i am just learning of this alleged incident..we are trying to verify and get in contact with witnesses to interview...to confirm and investigate"
More video here.
Assistant Chief Peter Newsham tells LL: "There was no police pulling guns on snowball people."
Newsham described the detective as a veteran detective.
*All photos courtesy of Matthew Bradley.
4:09 pm
The cop's Hummer had Maryland tags (#2568 with the "FOP" letters). He got out with his gun drawn and no visible badge because his car was hit by a snowball.
This video is from a few minutes before the incident: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-q5UjjuOX0
Everyone was just having fun. Cars were getting hit by (soft and mushy) snowballs, but they were also being pushed by people in the crowd when they got stuck (and quite a few of them did).
That cop is crazy.
4:17 pm
Here's some photos from early on before the Hummer arrived. First cop was only there for a short bit.
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=130311&id=209625399692
4:37 pm
Channel 7 just showed video footage of it....that's ridiculous...
4:41 pm
There's video here, but I can't make much sense of it.
4:52 pm
This son of a bitch needs to be identified and removed from the police department pronto! Like I have been saying on these blogs this police department is full of hot heads who have no right wearing a badge!
4:52 pm
Newschannel 8 has video, but is reporting it as a snowball fight turned "protest", which seems ridiculous.
4:57 pm
The WJLA story is bullshit. It was never a protest. The sign said "No War but Snowball War." It never specified Iraq or Afghanistan. If anything, it was intended to be ironic.
The guy in the maroon hummer pulled out his gun and never identified himself as a police officer. As soon as he drew a weapon I headed up 14th street with my friend.
The Hummer was targeted because it was a Hummer. It was the fourth of fifth Hummer hit all day. It was an unmarked police car and we had no way of knowing if it was a cop. Every other driver took it in good fun. The snowballs were soft and the cop's life was definitely NOT in danger. He had no reason to pull his gun. Pulling his gun out was an extremely dumb way to disperse a crowd and made the situation way more unstable.
MPD needs to suspend or dismiss this guy. He's a complete embarrassment to the city and to his fellow officers. It's behavior like this that breeds distrust of the police in communities.
5:43 pm
Police utilize violence against people all the time in this city , particularly against poor and working class people of color. Often times the motivation doesn't involve any sort of transgression, and sometimes it involves minor transgressions that the police severely over react to. That this cop felt safe pulling a gun is a sign of the level of police impunity in this city. That he pulled a gun on what was largely a couple of hundred young-urban-professionals is what makes it anomalous, and that it was a snowball fight is what makes its absurdity plain. But it's part and parcel of a policing apparatus that is often allowed to do what it wants, when it wants, and which routinely commits violent acts, or threatens to, against poor and working class people.
5:55 pm
america is such a dysfunctional society. if america was a puppy, youd put it down as the most humane thing to do.
6:01 pm
I don't really care what the uniformed officer did with his gun, it's the fact that he brandished it without identifying himself as a cop in any way.
The uniformed cops were fine and realized it was an absurd situation, but the detective was completely out of line.
6:05 pm
Probably got picked in high school cause he has a small penis so he has to try and be a BIG MAN now.
6:09 pm
Crazy.
Then again, it isn't a good idea to start pelting a passing car with snowballs in the first place.
6:13 pm
Fascist thug should have a gun pointed at HIM.
6:19 pm
Another uneducated clueless scum bag hired into the police force. Is anybody surprised? It's sad that our law enforcement agencies have become so run-down that intelligent people won't even consider it a career option. Instead of fighting bad guys on the street, you would have to spend an entire career fighting bad guys within the force. It's sad, it really is.
This guy should be fired, TODAY. Not tomorrow, not next year after he spent a year on paid-leave. TODAY. Fine him, and even a couple days in jail would be good.
6:24 pm
Why are these assholes out playing and trowing snowballs? Their dam asses should be in their houses and off the streets. The Cop should have shot the son of bitches for throwing snow balls at his vehicle. People it's bad outside and you should keep your ass inside and watch some televison, listening to music, fuck or be fuck, or take you ass to sleep or kill yourselves. You are some stupid mother fuckers. I can't wait for the world to be destroyed by man and many of you will be coming to live with me in "HELL". I can assure you, I will make your daily lives in "HELL" a painful experience.
6:27 pm
That punk ass dick cop will get what he deserves. He is an Ape. An animal. A piece of shit and his family is garbage. Cops are garbage just like this guy. This guy is an pig. The only animal that barely describes this guy and people like him. Sorry to the decent pig for using their name to describe such primitive, knuckle dragging son's of bitches called cops. Will this cop be fired? No. He will be praised and would have probably received a promotion if he would have shot some black kid. The points for his promotion would have been double if the kid is under 7 years old holding a cell phone that the dick cop can say was a gun.
6:33 pm
I grew up in DC, and this has been what I have come to expect from DC police; they over-react and it turns into a pissing contest. Its silly. What imbibes these officers with such vim and vigor, even over the last 30 years?
I guess it goes to show: you can't fix STUPID.
6:41 pm
Brandishing a gun, cop or not, in that situation (rather than brandishing a badge) .... this fails so many psyche indications, the faster this guy is put behind a desk without a gun the better off the community will.
7:11 pm
A simple search on Flickr for the tags 'snOMG DC' turns up a three photo sequence of the Hummer, the driver getting out of the Hummer, and the driver reaching for a holstered gun. Here's the last of that sequence. http://www.flickr.com/photos/ajashton/4197804321/in/photostream/
I was not there, but I'd say that's strong 1st-person evidence contradicting Assistant Chief Newsham's account.
7:13 pm
I was right there, front and center. Might have thrown a snowball or two at the hummer -- it was all in good fun. Then this guy got out of the car, and brandished a gun. Most of us who noticed freaked out and backed up. He didn't identify himself at all, so for about 10 minutes we thought he was a civilian gone awry.
7:26 pm
we have a video here: http://www.readysetdc.com
7:27 pm
This is one reason, among many, why I (as a Virginia resident) will probably NEVER choose to live in the District. D.C. is, at times, a joke.
7:30 pm
TNB. Give a black man a gun and a Hummer and this is what happens. He needs a toy gun and a Ford Escort instead. Oh, and no badge.
7:50 pm
See this is why only cops should be "The Only Ones" allowed to carry weapons.
7:55 pm
people helping the stuck cruiser:
http://12seconds.tv/v/4RJFA
7:57 pm
My name is Detective Baylor and it is my right to pull a gun on these punk kids when they hit my beautiful Hummer with a snowball. Think about it folks that snowball could have done some real damage to my 8,000 lb. over compensation machine. What does a man have to do to get respect around here, next time I'm gonna shoot somebody.
8:02 pm
knee grow... black piece of crap.black cops are trash.NI--GG--ER..go back to Africa
8:07 pm
a bunch of white kids throwing snowballs at some black nig. If i was the black guy, I would have shot because those white kids would have lynched him if he did not have a gun. I would have killed someone.
8:09 pm
its all fun until a NIger shows up
8:20 pm
This just goes to show how stupid the youth of today have really become. Spoiled little Brats is all they are. When I was a kid if I threw a snowball at a passing car, I did so knowing that if I got caught it might be followed by two whoopings. One from the driver of the car and one from my dad when the driver told him about it. I've said it once and I'll say it a thousand more times; Kids today have been made stupid and spoiled by a lack of ass whoopins'. They should be glad that it was a cop with a gun and not just some angry man on the edge who would have thought about killing them after the fact.
8:20 pm
He should be arrested for brandishing a fire arm, a felony in DC.
8:28 pm
This thread was fun until about 8:02 pm.
8:28 pm
Does anyone expect any blacks in DC to behave by civilized rules? I mean, come on.... has anyone lived in DC for more than 20 minutes?
And the fact that he's a cop - that's a whole other story. People become DC cops because they want to lord it over everyone else, not because they have any value for laws.
8:30 pm
The entire Police Dept. should take an entire month off. And not only do that, but also inform the criminals we would normally protect you from where your little spoiled tails live. Then sit back and watch as so many unspeakable things happened to you and just laugh. Never bite the hand that feeds you or insult the people who protect and take care of you. But that's asking way too much from a group of spoiled little racist idiots.
8:33 pm
You can also be pretty certain that the police already knew about this publicized snowball fight. He very well could have knowingly driven through the fight zone hoping for what actually happened.
8:38 pm
He over-reacted but no one got hurt and i'm sure he'll be reprimanded by his Supes. Aren't you guys going a bit overboard? Are the racist remarks necessary or is it your default setting? And, what does he being black have to do with him being a good or bad cop? Surely this will be blown out of proportion on certain opinion networks as it has been on this forum but I'd say i'm pretty sure he's embarrassed enough. He admitted to pulling the gun on tape and their are pictures of him brandishing the weapon. Can the ones who are reacting to this by comparing him to a gorilla or telling him to go back to Africa be good little boys and girls and revert to being closeted racists please. Thank you :)
8:44 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0RhossH1bm4&feature=player_embe
cop admits he pulled his gun out cause his car was hit with snowball
8:46 pm
I hate to say it, but throwing snowballs at passing automobiles is dangerous not only to the thrower, who may hit the wrong vehicle at the wrong time, but also to the operator of the vehicle who may get startled and run off into something. It is just plain stupid.
The officer was wrong for brandishing a gun, but the pea-brained children posturing as adults having a snowball fight near a city street are just as wrong.
They are lucky the guy was a cop, had it been a different hothead with a gun, it would not have just been brandished, it could have brought a tragic end to foolish horseplay.
Think about it.
8:48 pm
what's even more telling about this detective than his brandishing his gun, is the fact that he got into a shouting match with a civilian.
i thought cops were supposed to be calm and cool under pressure. if he really felt he was justified in pulling his weapon in his capacity as a cop, then he should've just calmly given up his badge number and been done with it.
instead, he clearly tries to defend himself, not as a cop, but as a fool who overreacted. if his actions were by the book, then his explanation should've been by the book. you don't get into a pissing match with a civilian on the street. in front of cameras, no less.
fail.
8:49 pm
I wrote to MPD about this and got the following response when I sent them the video:
Yes we have seen the video....the detective who had his car hit by the snowball was approached by the sworn third district patrol officer due to the call for a man with a gun
8:49 pm
It's also a felony to throw objects at a moving vehicle, but that should just be common sense for anyone over the age of 12. It could very easily cause an accident. But I guess noone there had the brain power to figure that out.
8:52 pm
The racist remarks above are scary. The unnecessary use of guns by cops is disgusting. No more violence! Peace and snowballs.
8:54 pm
No Pension. No benefits. Fired. Arrested. Tried before the courts. Simple process.
9:02 pm
This cop's behavior is disgraceful - whether he identified himself or not. We need to seriously reevaluate the psychological screening process. Personally, i think a 4 year highly specialized degree should be required for police work...Pay them more, but require a degree. This would weed out the dumb ones, as well as the ones with anger/control issues (a HUGE percentage of cops, i'm sad to say). It would also provide the foundation of knowledge needed for people performing one of the most important/profound/sensitive jobs in an allegedly free society.
9:07 pm
Folks, here it is.
1. You shouldn't be having an organized snowball fight on a busy street, and yes it was still busy with all the snow. Arrange your childish snowball fights in a park, which DC has an ample supply of, or save your energy for the next IMF meeting so you can go protest that.
2. Not one car was targeted until the hummer came along, then it was open season on someones car by a bunch of hipsters with too much self importance on their hands. Dozens of people start throwing stuff at me, I don't care if its a snowball or a rock, I am going to do whatever is in my power to shove it down your fucking whiny throats.
3. Let this be a lesson to you, that you don't start something, anything with someone you don't know or didn't engage you, which this guy didn't.
Lastly, grow the hell up. The childish whining coming over the tubes of the google net really makes me worry about the future of the country, if its the whining 20 year olds posting here who will run it.
3.
9:12 pm
Well said, Rob @ 8:48 pm
9:15 pm
how many cops do you know that can afford a hummer?
this guy is a dirty cop and an asshole.
ruin life tactics.
9:20 pm
Little shrimp dick cop waving his big gun around. New day another asshole cop. Yes but he's protecting us from stuff. No he's a pathetic piece of crap.
9:24 pm
Both sides were wrong. Snowballers (organizers 'futureMANAGING'?) wrong for playing in a major DC artery (emergency route, etc). Detective 'Baylor' was wrong for pulling out his weapon w/out identifying himself and not being under direct threat. He should be reprimanded. But why didn't the snow ball fight happen at Meridian Hill Park? Big, safe, wide open winter wonderland to play in just 2 blocks away?
9:25 pm
It's unbelievable how white people get mad when a gun is pulled on them by the cops but ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS side with a white cop that KILLS a black man for no reason (i.e. Sean Bell, Diallo, Oscar Grant). Gimme a break! This country claims to be so passed racism but an incident like this shows racism is still rampant just by these horrible comments. The last time I checked, throwing snowballs at an officer is assault!
9:30 pm
Yes, those high-speed moving vehicles were going APPROXIMATELY 5mph, in an area where a group of innocent people were having a well-publicized D.C. snowball fight.
Fire that fucking cop right now. Can you imagine if someone in the crowd also had a gun and that shit escalated??? But guess what, no one did - they were having a fun moment in the midst of a fantastic storm, and this guy flips his shit. Out. Out today.
9:34 pm
Let's refrain from racist remarks. The thread can be used to debate excessive force, the foolishness of throwing snowballs at slow moving gas guzzlers, or whatever. Just quit the racist BS.
Thank you.
9:44 pm
Come on out to Wyoming and pull that
shit, Shaft.
You'll get a barrel enema real quick.
9:57 pm
The cop also did another thing wrong: he stopped his hummer in the middle of the street it seems and jumped out. Road rage 101. And not the smartest thing to do on snow covered streets.
Now just waiting for the police to change their story and admit the detective drew his weapon.
10:02 pm
1) the presence of left/wing anarchist types should not be used as an indictment on this snowball fight. this is a free a free country and those men and women are entitled to express their views, provided they do not impede upon the rights of others.
2) the officer in the hummer did indeed wave a firearm IN ADDITION to his walkie-talkied. He failed to identify himself as a detective.
This incident should serve not only as a testament to the power of viral marketing, but also as a warning to the ever fractious relationship between average citizens and the police.
*Was there any reason for this man to get out of a car and wave a firearm at unarmed civilians?
*Why didn't he present a badge? Why didn't he announce himself?
*Is it safe to have officers who are so quick to lose their cool patrolling the streets during an emergency situation?
10:05 pm
yes throwing a snowball at an officer would be a felony. but to draw a weapon?! I've been an officer for 10 years! the sidearm is a defensive weapon! was he needing to defend himself in his nice big red hummer? taking a gun to a snowball fight? race doesn't matter here. white, black or in this case blue, he was entrusted by the people of DC to protect and serve. he has violated that trust (and i'm sure more than a few departmental regulations) and should either be demoted, or fired.
10:08 pm
Seems like the cop wanted to enforce 'white out' conditions. Again google the "only ones". Cops be better than you.
10:11 pm
Racist BS or not...black cop...pussy white boy...my money is on the cop.
10:21 pm
First off, the boys who will be witnesses should be arriagned with assulting an officer, public nussance, endangering public safety (not talking the vehicle, but some old lady walking down the street gets hit in the head by a random snowball. Falls over breaking a hip and each and every one of them would have been liable)And carrying a weapon (since they all seem to believe that the snowballs would be able to take out a crazy guy with a gun since none of them left after the cop came out carrying the gun.
Now who in thier right mind stays in the area when a crazy guy (white, black, hispanic, green, Doesnt matter) gets out of his high priced car brandishing a weapon. He is either a well off guy with good lawyers who will be able to clear his name after he shoots a few people, or he is a crazy guy with a gun who is going to shoot people. Why stick arround at that point. Scater and come back in a hour after he leaves. Teens nowadays dont think about death. Sad realy. Before you go on about how tough you are. One bullet in a major artery (even your leg) and you could bleed to death before the ambulance can get to you in a storm like that. Plus the report of the guy carrying a gun would stop the ambulance till the cops cleared the area.
Now the cop not identifying himself probably because he was off duty. So he should be charged with brandishing a firearm. Dealt with and given a suspension for a while (or some psych evaluation too) but fireing him is a bit on the extreme as no one got hurt. The snowballers should feel lucky like some have said, that this guy was a cop and kept his head before laying down some gunfire. As stated by some of the angry snowballer friends, none of them had a gun. So none of them would have been able to take out the crazy shooter before he emptied his clip(and possibly reloaded several times before the cops showed up). Now looking at the video there seemed to be several people who stuck arround, which would have given that crazy gunman multipule targets, and sorry but you dont bring a snowball to a gun fight.
10:28 pm
Denegrify DC NOW!!!
10:28 pm
I have lived across from the police academy for about 8 years in Brussels, Belgium. When there is snow about 20 to 30 high-schoolers on the way to school set-up snowballs and go at the police while they're exiting the police grounds.
It's a great laugh to watch from my terrace (balcony) and in all that time I have yet to see a police pull a gun. The worst I've seen is when the police come out in full force and overpower the kids ...
America is a very scarry place, never mind the criminal element ... it's the police I fear most. When I have colleagues traveling to the US I always warn them to co-operate beyond the need with any police because these blokes are a ticking time-bomb and any thing can set them off.
10:29 pm
Who thought it was a good idea to throw snowballs at any cars? Only one snowball has to hit the windshield before the driver loses sight and control of his or her car.
10:34 pm
Kill all pigs.
10:43 pm
Playing in the blizzard is no way for mature citizens to behave. They risk the health and safety of themselves and others. The police officer was correct to disperse the crowd in order to restore safety and prevent costly and unnecessary medical treatments. We must first consider how our individual actions affect the welfare of the wider community.
10:47 pm
ohboy: "Who thought it was a good idea to throw snowballs at any cars? Only one snowball has to hit the windshield before the driver loses sight and control of his or her car."
Wow, what an excuse, what a lame 'OMG I COULDN'T HELP MYSELF' excuse.
Is that the way you drive, fearful of any errant snowball to hit your windshield and then you'll spin out of control and kill a family of 4? Drivers MUST be reactionary. They MUST know what's going on around them at all times, and they MUST be ready to compensate in unexpected occurrences. That's why driving is a RIGHT not a PRIVILEGE.
I fear for myself, that I'm never on the road opposite YOU.
10:49 pm
"Playing in the blizzard is no way for mature citizens to behave. They risk the health and safety of themselves and others." WHAT THE F(CK TO YOU EXPECT FROM KIDS?
10:50 pm
Joe Mama: Driving is a right? Oh boy, we've come a long way....
10:52 pm
Story made CNN (angled against the detective). No one should be driving a hummer anytime (especially maroon), and unless he was on city business, he should not have been driving today after Mayor Fenty told everyone to stay off the streets. Please tell me this individual has a solid closure rate, or gives something of value to the people of DC that justifies his employment.
10:53 pm
What do I expect from kids? I expect them to be respectful and thoughtful. And when they can't be, I expect their parents or the civil authorities to control them.
10:53 pm
Jason Cherkis congrads on reporting the HELL out of this story. Thank god we have the CityPaper and don't have to only rely on crappy "official spokesman" WashingtonPost version. I'm curious what they will run in the Metro section tomorrow.
10:59 pm
For all the folks worrying over kids engaging in a snowball fight, do you really think the cop's reaction was appropriate? Should his response have really been to draw his weapon on a crowd without identifying himself?
11:06 pm
Snowball fight. Harmless fun. People having fun and making the best of a snowstorm which will cramp everyone's style for a few days. Laughing, yelling, good Christmas cheer. Helping stuck cars, and stuck cop cars too, on their way.
Until "Self-Important Detective" drives by.
SID goes creeping by and he sees/hears his car get smacked with a snowball but he doesn't get clear of whatever danger he thought was confronting him, he doesn't radio for backup, he doesn't even roll down his window and show his badge.
No, SID gets out and pulls a gun.
"Yeah, not so funny now you snowball throwers. Who's laughing now that it's clear as the gun in my hand that I have the power to kill you."
This is the same SID who runs red lights because no one will stop him. The same SID who would take a payoff or plant a gun on a body because, ya know, he has a tough job which doesn't pay enough and he feels ordinary rules don't actually apply to him - just to other people.
In my experience, most police officers are on the up and up, doing what they've sworn to do to the best of their abilities but there's always a few - as the pictures and video shows - who at the slightest provocation or challenge fly off the handle and are only a finger twitch away from KILLING or MAIMING another human being whose only crime was to get in the way.
Fuck him. Let him work for somebody else.
11:07 pm
When an officer comes upon a large group of people fighting in the street, he has a duty to protect and resume order. The snowy conditions do not exonerate any of the fighters from their poor behavior, which was the catalyst for the situation. The officer notified everyone that he was in charge by displaying his weapon.
The problem is that most people just don't think about the consequences of their own actions, and they're always looking for an excuse: snow, it seemed like a good idea at the time, he's driving a big bad hummer, he's Black, he's a corrupt cop...
Had these folks not chosen bad behavior, this situation would never had happened. The officer's duty is to respond to situations, and he is authorized to telegraph his authority by displaying his weapon.
11:09 pm
"The officer notified everyone that he was in charge by displaying his weapon."
That's certainly an odd way to show you are in charge.
11:10 pm
Odd, perhaps in your opinion. Effective without doubt.
11:11 pm
I was there and I have video of the gathering and an image of Detective Baylor with gun, who pulled it to scare the snowball throwers. Check it out: http://wordsofwitte.wordpress.com/2009/12/19/a-snowball-fight-erupts-bully-cop-spoils-the-fun/
11:11 pm
If this had been an ObamaMoney give away day would the youth have been throwing cheese?
11:12 pm
"Odd, perhaps in your opinion. Effective without doubt."
Certainly not professional. Am to understand that you are arguing that whenever anyone brandishes a gun, one should assume the person brandishing the gun is a police officer?
11:13 pm
The best thing about these comments is the abominable spelling by the racist thugs. It would be funny if they weren't walking among us...cretins.
11:17 pm
The video at wordsofwitte shows an unruly mob fighting amid the traffic in the middle of the city street. This choice of behavior requires only one spark to change it from snowballs to bricks and bats. Snow is no excuse to throw projectiles at others in the middle of a busy street. It sounds like the brave officer entered the crowd alone and without backup.
Matt: Whether you believe a person is an officer or a thug, when he brandishes the weapon he is in charge.
11:19 pm
So had Mr. Baylor been a civilian instead of a police officer, would it have been incumbent on the crowd to follow his orders?
11:27 pm
@joe: "Unruly mob" is a gross overstatement. It was a snowball fight. Should have been held in Meridian Hill Park, but that doesn't excuse the detective's behavior.
If he felt the need to control an unruly mob as a policeman, he should have a)shown a badge and identified himself, b) not drawn his gun, and c) called for backup.
"Brandishing his weapon" should not have been his method of choice for demonstrating that he is in charge. Come on. Riot police in actual riot situations (which this was not) wait longer than he did before drawing their weapons.
11:31 pm
First off reading some of these comments like from idots like, 'A', which must stand for (asshole) and 'haha' who should go to some other country like Iran. I'm tired when morons use the line of shit, people of color or the workers, go sell your socialism shit somewhere else.
This detective, this son of a bitch was out of control and should be removed from the force! It's on tape there are witnesses so why hasn't Chief Lanner at lease suspend this guy for now? I have said before this police department has a disipline problem and a lack of education amoung not only the rank and file officers but from lieutenants and above.
We are now seeing what happens when you lower educational and mental standards just to put bodies on the street, like Marion Barry did back in the 90's and is still in practice today.
11:33 pm
Unruly mob: throwing projectiles at people and property; interfering with traffic. I don't think unruly is an overstatement at all. Can we agree on disorderly?
Brandishing his weapon: the best way to get the attention of all of these fighters and prevent any further risk to public safety and property. Would you prefer he had meekly introduced himself to everyone with a warm handshake and ask that they not engage in that behavior?
Dallas wins! Yay!
11:38 pm
I agree... if this was a bunch of black kids throwing snowballs at passing cars, some of these same people involved today and making comments would have called the police to complain for fear of their safety.
The fact that these grown adults thought it was ok to throw snowballs at each other and passing cars is just plain silly.
I want my city back...
11:38 pm
Snowballs are technically projectiles, but we're talking soft snow here, not ice, not rocks.
If he felt he was justified in drawing his weapon (and I still don't agree with his decision), it was still imperative that he identify himself as a detective. He did not.
11:43 pm
Isn't 14th Street a Snow Emergency route? Don't we ticket and tow cars that are parked there because the route is vitally important during an emergency? Why should the fighters be given a pass for blocking access to the emergency route during an emergency? It was a bad idea and a poor decision to participate in the fight.
The officer's behavior was prompted by what he saw (and what we have all seen now thanks to YouTube!), and his actions were likely to be found to be perfectly authorized and proper. These snow fighters need to stop trying to justify their poor choice to engage in disorderly behavior by twisting an officer's actions into an abuse of power. The officer did not abuse anyone, unlike the snow fighters.
11:44 pm
full video here - http://www.acc-tv.com/sites/wjla/news/stories/1209/video/dcsnowballfight121909.flv
11:51 pm
I sure would enjoy hearing Detective Baylor explain his thought process in escalating directly from "snowball" to "lethal force" on the use-of-force continuum he was (hopefully) taught on Day 1 of the police academy. Extraordinarily unprofessional! But then again, anyone who drives a Hummer in the first place is likely compensating for something, and waving a gun at a bunch of kids for the "crime" of playing in the snow is probably in the same chapter of the DSMV.
11:57 pm
Here's his thought process: What's this? A couple dozen people fighting in the middle of 14th street with traffic passing by - a street whose passage is deemed of vital importance during a snow emergency? I'm alone. Do I wait for backup and risk someone being injured by a projectile or fist or other weapon, or do I take action alone. OK I take action alone. But I'm not in uniform. How do I get their attention and get them to cease and disperse as quickly as possible? My weapon is a symbol of my legitimate authority in this city, and it will certainly make them stop fighting as soon as they see it. GO.
12:01 am
Oh, and here's some more of his thought process: Why do I care about the safety of these silly people? Why should I put myself at risk? I could continue in the warmth and comfort of my hummer and no one would even notice that I passed them by. Oh, but wait, there might be innocent people passing by who could get injured by a projectile. Or the disorderly mob could be the perfect time for a real thug to smash and grab property from the merchants along this street. It's my duty to intervene. GO.
12:02 am
Great story! I'm going to share this one. This whole time i've been waiting for someone to say...The detective was heard saying "DAMN why does this have to happen to me, I'm just days from my retirement."
(lol lethal weapon reference)
12:03 am
I think the detective actually pulled an assault rifle out however the editors replaced assault rifle with "walkie-talkie" just like they did in E.T.
12:05 am
Again, wrong. A badge is a symbol of his legitimate authority in this city. A badge in conjunction with a gun is a symbol of his legitimate authority in this city. A gun alone is not. Anyone can wave a gun around. You haven't addressed his failure to identify himself as a police detective. What are your thoughts on this?
Also, you continue to use language which characterizes the situation as a riot, alluding to weapons, etc. Watch the video. It was kids having a snowball fight. They shouldn't have been in the street, but it was still just a snowball fight.
12:06 am
"Just joe," you've convinced me. I'm sort of disappointed now that Detective Baylor didn't unload his revolver in someone's face in order to restore order and ensure the smooth functioning of 14th Street as an important traffic corridor.
Probably the best thing for public safety and respect for the rule of law would have been if the whole lot of those missile-launching thugs had been killed on the spot in a remorseless police riot orgy and their organs harvested for a bacchanalian feast tonight at Chief Lanier's and Michelle Rhee's lovepad.
12:11 am
Rhee and Lanier's love pad. EEEWWW! Now I'm going to have nightmares.
12:23 am
What if there was another psycho in the crowd and that psycho feared for his life as a crazy man with a gun approached him? That would have been a recipe for disaster. If I had a gun in my car and I was parked on a street and I saw some crazy guy brandishing a firearm I would definitely go back to my car to retrieve it. I would hate for there to be one of those mass psycho shootings in front of my eyes.
If I saw someone brandishing a firearm on my street I would definitely call the police and then go get my shotgun and find an inconspicuous place to stand near a window to shoot the bastard if he decided to start shooting up my street. Brandishing a firearm like that is a blatant act of aggression, and quite honestly if he POINTED it at someone he would deserve to be shot. That was a very dangerous situation that could have turned violent, and this public servant needs to go to prison for inducing panic, intimidation, etc. Surely there is a felony crime for threatening someone with a firearm.
12:27 am
Metropolitan Police Department (MPD) Detective Elmer "Buddy" Baylor, Jr.
ELMER BAYLOR, 751 DELAWARE AVE SW, WASHINGTON, DC
*or*
ELMER H BAYLOR, 1961, 3820 5TH ST NW, WASHINGTON, DC
12:35 am
Just posted a new video showing the cop with his gun:
http://www.washingtoncitypaper.com/blogs/citydesk/2009/12/20/video-d-c-cop-draws-weapon-during-snowball-fight/
12:44 am
I just hope the White House Social Secretary gets her act in order so this Detective Baylor doesn't end up driving his Hummer onto the lawn at 1600 Pennsylvania during the next Easter Egg roll. Those events get pretty unruly, you know.
12:50 am
if only there was this type of citizen exposure of police abuse of power when it mattered.
12:51 am
Despite the comments of a few douchebags here, this was NOT a case of a Black cop pulling a gun on a bunch of white kids. The crowd was racially mixed...VERY diverse.
And it was more celebratory than unruly.
12:55 am
Please don't post random addresses on a public forum, people! That's just not cool. Just because you can Google doesn't necessarily mean you should.
1:09 am
ALL COPS ARE DIRTY!!! A FEW MAY NOT HAVE DONE ANYTHING THEMSELVES BUT THEY KNOW A COP WHO HAS AND DID NOTHING TO STOP IT OR WORSE HELPED TO COVER IT UP. As Donald Rumsfeld said about Abu Ghraib, "its not the torture, its the damn cell phones thats the problem." Cops arent going to keep getting away with this, and you better straighten up before the public reaches a tipping point and middle class, bourgeois
milquetoast have no respect for your brutal thuggish behavior and then we are coming after YOU!
1:12 am
Lovely. The comments above really elevate the level of conversation here. Lofty thoughts, indeed.
1:12 am
Good grief. 'Just joe at 10:43 pm' - What on earth is wrong with you? Are you an American? I realize our national character has fallen over the last few decades..That we've lost whatever sense of independence once existed within us....but geez - are you kidding?? You sound like some sort of semi-fascist automaton. We are a free country! A free people! Snowball fights, for the love of god, do not pose a serious risk to the public. Shall we lock our doors and sleep in bubblewrap? "The police officer was correct to disperse the crowd in order to restore safety and prevent costly and unnecessary medical treatments." I can only assume you are against the use of cars, except for cases of extreme emergency, right? Good god man, you need to seriously reevaluate your perspective. Really.
1:15 am
freeze his ass.
i mean fire. i meant fire. really. i swear.
1:19 am
Did anyone notice that the Detective just garb any kid and was more then ready to charge him for the assault.You can clearly see that it wasn't the one who through the snowball at him.I'm severely disappointed in Detective Baylor's actions he shoved a kid on the curb, he's instigating another through and won't listen to anyone other than the fellow lawmen.These kids were pushing out cars that got stuck and throwing 8oz snowballs at Hummers around 6,000 pounds.He should have either kept driving or instead of waving his gun, he could have thrown some snowballs back at them.
1:26 am
I still believe the detective was totally out of line and should be suspended, at least, but after watching the new video...
What is wrong with some of these kids?! When someone produces a gun the proper response is to get the fuck out of that area. Some of these kids continued throwing snowballs at the detective and taunting him, AFTER the gun was pulled. What kind of bubble do you have to be living in to not recognize the seriousness of an angry dude with a gun?
2:12 am
Assistant Chief Peter Newsham should be fired.
He is the guy who gave the statement:
"There was no police pulling guns on snowball people."
We know as a fact from the detectives own mouth that he pulled a gun, as seen on the video.
Asisstant Chief Peter Newsham 100% lied in his statement. Assistant Chief Peter Newsham lied to protect his detective who pulled a gun at a snowball fight.
Fire Peter Newsham.
2:13 am
Is snow, a way of life spirit, a fun way some time to find a friend a busy intelectual friend, relax
2:23 am
Is this detective Michael Baylor?
3471 23rd St SE
Washington D.C. 20020
(202) 889-6358
3:09 am
I wish people would stop calling the snowball throwers "kids". These were adults acting like kids.
Large crowds engaging in what starts off as seemingly harmless behavior can escalate, especially when it involves throwing things at each other. Not to mention they started throwing snowballs at passing cars on a street designated as a snow emergency route. To me, there's no excuse for their petty behavior.
The only thing the detective did wrong was to not identify himself as a cop right away. However, I wasn't there to know whether he identified himself or not. The crowd was very loud, so it's possible they didn't hear him. It would be hard to tell by looking because he was in plain clothes.
And how silly of this band of adults to keep throwing snowballs even after a gun was drawn. This is why certain people are such an easy target for crime...
3:34 am
@ #115
There are about five or six videos of the snowballs fight. It hs the sounds of fun and laughter all the way through. The crowd stopped to help a DC police car get out of a snow drift by pushing the car. There was no disrespect or disorderly behavior.
In an age where conspicuous consumption is no longer the banner of respect, a single guy drives a massive, gas-guzzling Hummer through the intersection. In lieu of throwing rocks at a car that is the very emblem of greed and elitism and which any respectible American would have done, these folks through snowballs.
This "officer" is driving a vehicle whose design is a derivative of the military vehicles our troops are being killed in daily. Our troops get hit with bombs and enemy fire and they respond with guns. This asshole drives through a street that was clearly the scene of a large playful snowball fight. His care get hit with a snowball and he goes ballistic. Nevermind that photos indicate that his car was covered in snow already.
This isn't about snowballs or the fun being had by many folks in the neighborhood. This story is about a man sworn to honor, server, and protect the city and its residents, who is unable to respond in a professional manner. He attempted pure intimidation and threads of gun violence. He threatened a number of people and admitted enough on film.
This guy does not have the demeanor to carry a weapon or the cool head and people skills required to be a detective or any level police officer.
His gun should have been confiscated based on the testimony of complainants in the crowd. This was no innocent misunderstanding, This is a guy out of control and in need of psychological help.
4:31 am
I was there in the crowd, and the dude got out of his car with a police radio. He got beamed in the face by a hard snowball. That's like getting slapped across the face. It doesn't mean it was cool of the detective to draw his gun, but I do understand why he felt threatened. Tons of people screaming, things being chucked at your face, whiskey being passed around. Just another viewpoint here.
4:34 am
I do sincerely hope that at the very least he gets a reprimand. Additionally, people even jokingly should not be throwing snowballs ESPECIALLY in DC.
From the comments on this board, it's apparent that the US is playing with fire: this freedom of speech thing is ridiculous. The least one should have is a test of people's basic empathy prior to unleashing their inarticulacy and proto-fascist sentiments on the general public. Amusing to think that things would change with a black president, this country is doomed due to the sheer and utter ignorance of the masses and no other reason. Wow! China here we ALL come as refugees
4:34 am
When snowballs are outlawed only outlaws will have snowballs!
4:35 am
Whaddya call 10,000 cops at the bottom of the sea? A very poor start.
4:37 am
Everyone is very lucky there wasn't a gun owner present that felt his life or the life of another in danger by a deranged idiot brandishing a weapon.
4:42 am
Why wasn't the Hummer driver ticketed for an equipment violation? His tires were so badly worn that snow was caked on where the tread was supposed to be.
6:12 am
Racism is alive and well in race divided Washington. Why were these grown ass white men and women out at a major intersection throwing snow balls out into the street instead of inside a park? They should have stay in their homes/apartments on yesterday and stayed off the streets inorder for DPW to clear the major arteries. If these were black D.C. residents acting like savages, these white gentrifiers would have called the Third District to come and remove or arrest the Negroes. I am so sick of whites in America thinking they can do whatever the fuck they want. Tiger Woods thought he was white and could get away with shit, but white America proved his black ass wrong for fucking their white women.
6:21 am
Fuck you spoiled people. I'm no cop, but you throw something at me, I don't care if it is a snowball or not, and I'll come for your dumb ass. The people who caused the situation were the dumbasses thowing snowballs at the vehicle, not the cop. Losers.
6:41 am
I just saw the video on News4 and the arrogant white boy with the hood on was yelling at the officer by asking him, what is your badge number. I agree with DUDE, these are a bunch of spoiled ass whites who have been use to everything given to them in life on earth. Why in the world would they be at 14th & U Street NW having a fucking snow ball fight? I tell you, this would not have been tolerated if a group of blacks had been out there acting like animals. I agree with others, keep you fucking asses in your homes/apartments today and watch a good movie or game on television.
6:46 am
P.S. All police aren't bad people and yes a few are assholes and criminals, but these arrogant whites shouldn't have been out in the street throwing snowballs at vehicles. I am so glad whites will be the minority in the United States in 2050. It will be another South Africa with a non white majority, although many Hispanics see themselves as white, not brown, colored, or Negro.
6:49 am
Hey guys, you can always stay home and listen to my music and chill with your man, woman, partner, lover, dog, or whatever you are into these days. LOL
6:52 am
Dam, I wonder how many of the guys in the crowd was gay or bisexual? Dam, I would have loved to fuck some good tight white ass on yesterday and got my cock sucked. The last time fellahs, don't have a snowball fight, let's have an orgy and smoke some weed. King Fenty might would like that.
7:43 am
CP, 145 comments - now that's what I'm talking about!
Congrats.
8:13 am
Trust me, if one of those snow balls had missed their intended target and hit me, someone's ass would have been kicked.
8:15 am
The fact is that this man is now an UNconvicted felon. Which means not only should he be doing lite time for this but he should under brandishing laws lose his right to own a firearm. Firearms are not for snowball fights, and clearly he thinks this was acceptable behavior becuase he is defending it on camera.
This guy is going to be suspended at max.
its up to you people who were there to push this all the way.
The judges and the "force" always side with one another. always!
but you have the video evidence and if you must take it to the supreme court i would highly recomend you do that. you will win...and when you do all the fees will be reimburst.
8:23 am
Also i feel i should add that he didnt have to get out of his car. I know he got his hummer hit by a snowball but as you can clearly see the snow that day was basically slush and even if it wasnt slushy.
HUMMERS were designed for the FREAKING MILITARY!
that and he has a better chance getting his paint scratched in the parking lot while he is buying grocierys then he does from one of those slush balls.
HUGE DUSH BAG. Book em dano
8:40 am
Reverse the races of the people involved and this is a non-story.
8:40 am
I'm glad i didn't take that job i was offered with the DC Police . I took another offer . I joined the HAZNIG Team at Tom Shelly's Wild NlGGER ANIMAL PARK . I have a much more rewarding career than i ever could have at a department whose ranks are Fuxated by a majority of NlGGERS With Badges instead of Police Officers .
8:42 am
Guess the snowball fighters don't realize that throwing objects at moving vehicles is against the law. All in fun right? Until they hit a car and the car hits a person.
I believe the officer was completely justified and I think the people asking for the officer to be fired for trying to restore order sound like spoiled brats.
8:54 am
Umm...is anyone monitoring the comments thread here? Is racist hate speech acceptable here? Not even the WTOP site permits such comments.
8:59 am
I believe in free speech. That's why I like the City Paper. Fuck the Washington Post and WTOP for their censorship. I want to fuck some white asshole today, but not Miss Jim Graham or David Catania. These are 2 ugly white Queens.
9:03 am
Okay, first of all you could barely stand outside without your face covered, so any bandanna or other coverage on people's faces was done not for protest but for warmth. Second of all I think this detective should be punished, maybe not lose his job but make him apologize in a press conference. Thirdly, it appears to me that the uniformed officer had his gun out because he was responding to an "armed man"call not in support of the detective.
9:27 am
I've got to agree with the charge that brandishing a weapon at an intersection filled with people, some who weren't even involved in the snow ball fight, was entirely overreacting and could have led to a very sad and frightening outcome. There should be some type of formal consequences for the detective.
But I also agree that deciding to hold the snowball fight at 14th and U, especially when it became evident that people were trying to drive on the road before the worst of the storm, was thoughtless and inappropriate.
Snowball fights are a great way to spend an afternoon, but they belong in a park. The initial snowball fight web invitation did debate whether the location should have been a park vs. a street corner - obviously the wrong decision was made.
Lastly, I am also bewildered that someone would actually throw a snowball directly at a person holding a gun. To the person who did this - you not only endangered yourself but, more importantly, the many innocent people surrounding you who had just come out to play. Per the video, you're obviously older than 16, which means you should have known better. Shame on you too for showing the same poor decision making skills and arrogance as the detective who pulled his gun in the first place.
9:33 am
Thank you Concered Citizen for your rational comment. Unfortunately, these people were idiots for being out there in a snow storm throwing snow balls. Shit if someone were to hit me, I would get angry too. We are living in a very stressful society. People are on edge with their attitudes. Try shopping in Safeway, the clerks have nasty attitudes and customer service is the same at most businesses these days.
9:43 am
Why do they let those sub-human apes have weapons?
9:48 am
Soon I will be strong enough to help man destroy earth and themselves. Many of my Demons walk the earth pocessing innocent souls like the fools throwing snow balls and the idiot black ape along with the white apes too. It's called having free will and many of you suckers are weak. I can assure you, I don't discriminate and many of you will burn an eternal death daily in my kingdom, because in "HELL", there's no time.
10:39 am
I can see both side of the story here. For one, a busy and needed street is NO place for a snowball fight. As mentioned by others, such an event is better suited at a park, where no one can get hurt, other than the people particpating. On the other hand, the actions of the detective is reperhensible, and should be given a good reprimand/warning, unless other codes were violated by his actions. Both sidea are at fault here, and both sides need to face and understand the consequences of thier actions.
10:48 am
Assistant Chief Peter Newsham said, "There was no police pulling guns on snowball people."
That's a clear indication this grammatically-challenged police official has no intention of investigating a rogue cop.
Newsham has reportedly suggested that Detective Elmer Baylor was responding to a 911 call of a man brandishing a gun.
Let's hear the tape of that 911 call. I'll be the first to guess that any 911 call of that nature was to report Baylor as the one who was brandishing a gun.
Furthermore, DCist.com indicates two District residential addresses for Elmer Baylor. Is this the same Detective Elmer Baylor who drives a Hummer with Maryland license plates? Is he also not a scofflaw when it comes to obeying DC/MD vehicle registration laws?
10:49 am
Thank goodness there were so many people there with video equipment to capture what actually happened. A police spokesman told the WaPo that the officer never pulled his weapon. The Asst. Chief said that the officer holstered his cellphone and someone must have seen his gun and called the police. The guy was brandishing his gun like he was in the wild, wild, west and he didn't identify himself as an officer. What if someone had hit him over the head with a brick in defense of the crowd? I also like that the crowd asked for his ID and was not intimidated. This is not like hitting a black kid with a police car in the ghetto. If the DC police don't take action against this officer who feels that he has the right to protect his vehicle from snowballs with deadly force then the entire force is corrupt.
10:50 am
Awesome the way one cop who shouldn't be carrying a gun starts a race war.
Ward 4 and NS are equally disgusting in their racism. Put the two of you together and kill each other so none of us have to deal with your ugliness.
10:59 am
Rather interesting turn of events. Unfortunately fines for throwing snowballs are not yet tax deductible, so you will not be able to claim a tax deduction on your tax return next year.
The first-time homebuyer credit has been extended until April 30, 2010. You may qualify to receive up to $8,500.00.
11:02 am
See my eye-witness post on this - Detective Pulls Gun on DC Fun http://ownthepress.com/?p=714
I am filing a Citizen Complaint to the DC police and I encourage you to do the same: http://mpdc.dc.gov/mpdc/cwp/view,a,1241,q,548649,mpdcNav_GID,1523,mpdcNav,|.asp
Why? Because this is not the kind of person I want serving me and my community. He threatened and scared people and acted in a dangerous manner.
11:19 am
how does a detective afford to drive a hummer????
what a jerk.
11:22 am
those people are crazy. think before you act.
1. why does the car he drives matter? if he was driving a beat up toyota, no one would have mentioned it (that's called jealousy). a commenter asks how does a cop get a hummer...are you serious?
2. why does his race matter? a cop is a cop no matter his race. let's reverse this and say a white cop pulled a gun on a group of black kids, the kids would be called thugs/gangsters.
people are dumb these days.
11:26 am
The first police officer who attended was being completely reasonable, the public were being completely over the top with the situation, it seems like typical american behavior. 5 stars to the officer for remaining calm and reasonable.
11:55 am
I am sure the kneejerk response from the police will be that the officer "acted in an appropriate manner." Except that he failed to Tase anyone.
11:57 am
so why do white peopel think they can throw snowballs at trucks AND people and its all just fun?
The guys a cop, he can pull his gun out any time when he feel he could be in danger. Stupid white folks pack rocks in snowballs, things could have been deadly
should of locked up the dumb focks who think its cool to throw snowballs at people and their property
11:59 am
This cop is a danger to himself & especially to others!
12:02 pm
The crowd was wrong to throw snowballs (projectiles with enough mass to be thrown and potentially cause damage) at people or vehicles who were obviously not willing participants. This was law-breaking.
I live in New England where snowfall is common. Snowballs break glass and dent vehicles. They also can cause permanent injury. Snow is frozen water (ice), however 'soft' and 'slushy' idiots have attempted to describe it here. Wet snow is the heaviest.
That a Hummer is a large and attractive (jealousy?) target speaks to elements of immaturity and mob mentality. If it was a granny in a Ford Fiesta then would a barrage of snowballs still be okay?
What if the Hummer gets damaged by elements of a mob who surely will not take financial responsibility for the damage? Who pays...yuppies having fun?
The people who had the adolescent urge to throw snowballs should have limited their fun to throwing them at each other. They had no right to throw them at non-participants. I think people who assault others should be punished.
Finally, one officer addressing 50+ people who apparently didn't give a damn that he had a radio (as if everybody carries a two-way radio) was walking away after a few words when he got hit by a snowball. He then drew his weapon, appropriately in my opinion.
12:03 pm
I think Satan needs a HUG...
12:28 pm
Holy crap. proballdc actually wrote something I agree with @8:42 PM/comment #38.
Folks- A snowball fight is all good fun, but a couple hundred people out throwing snowballs at people/vehicles who are probably on the clock in the midst a major intersection and in the midst of a declared city-wide emergency is 100% dumb. There's just no escaping that.
If I were that cop, I'd have started writing people up for jaywalking or assault, both of which would have been totally legit, and if that didn't work I'd have gotten creative.
12:30 pm
I noticed that true to form, Satan sees nothing wrong with a cop pulling a gun on kids having a snowball fight. He's as bad as the cop.
And the fact that he feels threatened inside a Hummer just shows you either he's a chickendropping or his Hummer wouldn't pass a crash test.
12:31 pm
Oh, and CP, can you please delete the racist crap here and also consider blocking the IP addresses it's sent from?
Thanks,
drez
12:33 pm
And for the rest of the girlie men who are horrified by a snowball fight, go back to bed, turn your electric blanket to nine, stick your thumb in your mouth, and go to sleep. You must have had a rough time in school being labeled such a sissy.
12:37 pm
And for those who others who are horrified by someone throwing a snowball at someone unknown and think that justifies drawing a gun, get a life. A normal cop, if there is such a thing, would have called in sick, parked his car, and joined in the snowball fight. Only some wimp from the South who never saw snow doesn't understand what snowball fights are all about.
12:45 pm
Texas Aggie, you have the mind of a teenager. If you are older then you should take pause.
'Girlie men', really? You are channeling 'Hans and Franz' from Saturday Night Live or, worse, Schwarzenegger. Do you consider them the basis of your masculinity...television characters?
Does the term 'personal responsibility' mean anything to you? Do you own a vehicle and would you want it damaged by a barrage of snowballs from a group of people like you? I guess that you can afford to repair it since you can afford to be mindless.
12:53 pm
MoonCoon, you're SERIOUSly an IDIOT.
12:53 pm
I notice the self righteous, prideful, arrogant and, in some cases, just flat out RACIST posts attacking this police detective for pulling his gun on some grown folks who think it's appropriate to throw snowballs at people's cars.
While it wasn't right for him to draw his weapon, the grown men and women throwing snowballs were out of line as well.
Beyond that, every day, in DC and every other major American city with a large Black population, young men and women of color are brutalized by the cops as a matter of policy.
This incident has nothing in common with that institutionalized abuse.
In this case, a cop got mad at a group of idiots behaving in an antisocial way - yeah, he overreacted, but what the hell were you nimrods doing out there throwing snowballs in the first place?
And yes, when you hit a cop's vehicle, you're going to have a problem - even if you're a White hipster, and he's a Black man - because he's a DETECTIVE and yes they get to do that.
It's not a question of his educational status (which is a codeword for his race) or anything else like that - it's because he wears a badge, and you don't.
12:57 pm
You see how they react whenever anyone shows one hint of defiance? This is ingrained, and it comes from the very top down of command structure crowned by the privileged few. Defy "Authority" and you will face coercion and forced compliance.
Think this is stupid? Wait till they lose control of the currency or some other real deal crisis hits. You're gonna get gov't rifles jammed up your a** at the drop of a hat (probably by "Contractors" no less). You are subjects...or consumers, depending on who you talk to...not citizens.
And all governments do this, sooner or later. Things will get shaky, elites and their hired guns will shut you down by any and all means to preserve themselves. That is the course of history.
This is only a small portend of things to come that bubbles to the top now and again.
See now why 2nd Amendment is #2? It is the only right capable of backing up the others when these clowns go totally over the edge...as is their habit.
You will find out about government just like we did in Balkans. "Here to help." Yea, right. Go talk to Sarajevo and see how much government helped them out.
.
12:57 pm
Shows to go you that the personality profile of people who drive a Hummer is blind to the color of person behind the wheel.
Also would seem that a black man turns whiter when brandishing a badge of the law.
1:01 pm
Baylor's action are reprehensible. I would like to see this nutcase removed from the PD, because his actions were over the top.Having this armed man prowling the streets is frightening. Certainly, his judgement is extremely poor.
1:03 pm
Mosby and others who are so anti-government, please describe your ideal society. Clearly, it would not place value on proprty and embrace social norms and the rule of "agree" law. Would you rather 300 million individual uninformed jurisdictions...anarchy?
1:03 pm
This nutcase should be fired.
1:06 pm
My grandfather always said, and I quote, "If they want to be a cop, they shouldn't!"
1:14 pm
Not-so-sane dude, is it okay for you to snowball someone or something without stated or implied permission? Yes or No.
Of course, your impulse will be to side-step the question to ask another.
Is it okay for an unrecognizable officer to display a two-way radio and then, when taunted, brandish his weapon?
I say he should have identified himself (he may have but wasn't heard) but was right to stop the activity by the means at his disposal. Had he shown his badge would the crowd simply have said 'yes sir' and disbanded?
1:36 pm
Stereotypical racists hating on a black man doing his job. Those crackers should not have thrown those snowballs at his new hummer. He had to pimp quite a few hoes to afford the new paint job. All you whiteys out there trying to keep a brother down throwing white fluffy stuff at him and all that you know whut im saying.
1:51 pm
Maryland Tags and Hummer.
That says it all.
I bet this gentleman has brandished his gun before, maybe when someone passes him on the GW Parkway, maybe when someone is following too closely. Who knows.
Maryland and PG County drivers are some of the most aggressive and entitled I have ever known. This case is yet another reason to give them wide berth.
1:55 pm
Wow, Burt Fisher you sure are mean. What's up with the nigger word? It seems to me that all of these grown-ass people had nothing better to do during a snow storm was to throw snowballs at passing cars. The detective should have started firing his gun, and them we would have a story to talk about. He will not be fired, because then Chief Lainer would have to tell what she knows about our King Fenty's wife beating allegations, Rhee would have to tell why she fired all of those teachers, Nickles would have tell why he covered for Chief Ramsey during Pershing Park, etc.
1:59 pm
Indeed, it is a little ironic that Newsham is also at the center of the mass false arrests at Pershing Park:
http://www.washingtoncitypaper.com/topics/pershing-park/
2:06 pm
Is it safe to say that it is the same individual pumping the same racist vulgarity under different assumed names? The context and sentence structure (such that it is) is very similar.
Someone didn't give them the memo, the term "nigger" is so 1960's. It just doesn't have the same bite that it used to. Particularly from someone typing it anonymously outside of the presence of anyone he/she may be referencing. Have the ball's to shout it loud to the next African American man, professional even (completely suited down) on your commute to work Monday morning, assuming you work, and report back on your findings.
2:29 pm
Ya'll gots a dolluh iz can hab? Weez needs us a bottle o' Thunderbird.
2:33 pm
@ Jason Cherkis
What is Citypaper's forum policy? Is it hands-off? Many internet forums enforce basic standards of civility. The vile racist shit on this thread is ridiculous. It's almost worse than Youtube.
2:43 pm
Actually, I'm GLAD that Citypaper doesn't moderate it's forums.
Its nice to get an unfiltered glimpse into the mindset of the White urban hipster and get a clear view of the Klansman within!
2:44 pm
Those white snowballs be raciss-N-sheeit !
2:45 pm
thats ridicilous!
one thing which pisses me also off: Obama just came back from Copenhagen and the police in his city is driving around with Hummers!! how serious can obama mean his clima initiatives if this car is still not banned from the streets??
2:53 pm
Despite how "stupid" some of you think the EXTREMELY WELL publicized snowball fight was... pulling a gun on someone for hitting you (or your car) is just retarded... What if when the cop pulled his gun, someone else pulled a gun on him feeling THEY were in danger...? A snowball is a snowball. When you pull a gun on kids, it's a whole new level and just stupid.
And watching the youtube video, he had no idea how to handle the situation. It's a joke he was presented as a "veteran" cop. Who cares how long you do something, that doesn't determine if you're worth anything.
And as for asking for the guys badge number, that's exactly what you should have done. Instead of all you obviously racists commenting here saying the "spoiled white kids" shouldn't have done [insert more whining here], you should think that the "veteran cop" brandished his gun because SOMEONE through a snowball... AND WE DON'T EVEN KNOW IF IT WAS AIMED AT HIM OR NOT.
Why don't you guys apply some logic before you rant and whine? It's just sad... seriously.
If I were one of their parents and I heard a cop pulled a gun on my child during a snowball fight, without even knowing WHO IN THE WORLD through the snowball, or why... You bet your butt I'd be getting his badge number.
3:03 pm
Ben: We don't have a comments policy. We only hope that folks police each other and direct the comments to meaningful dialogue. I am embarrassed by the racist BS on this thread but am heartened that people have called the worst folks out.
If you can offer some suggestions on a comments policy, we would be happy to consider it.
3:21 pm
To everyone using the word "nigger" in their post: once you use that word, NO ONE TAKES YOU SERIOUSLY. Quite frankly, I am surprised to see that you follow the news. I didn't realize you got internet service out there in the corn fields? I know you get all heated and that's the only thing that comes to your simplistic little mind, but please refrain in the future. I am a white girl born and raised in Mississippi myself, and YOU ARE ALL AN EMBARRASSMENT to the south. Now get off the web and go back to your klan meeting.
3:33 pm
To those saying that snowballs are harmless, that's simply not true. A few winters ago there was a 8 car pile up on 295 when some kid threw some snowballs over the bridge and hit an unsuspecting car that swerved.
That's an extreme case and the snowballs were harder because it was the day after a snowfall, but the reality is that it is never safe to throw things at cars, especially when they are driving in unsafe weather conditions during a declared snow emergency.
I think these idiot adults who thought it was cool to have a snowball fight across a busy intersection are just as guilty as the cop.
3:39 pm
I do not know which is more disgusting. A cop pulling a guy because his car got hit with a snowball or all the racist comments posted here. What purpose does the City Paper have in allowing commenters to spew their racist hatred here? The 1st amendment is a restriction on the government not a requirement for newspaper to post every racist comment ignorant hate filled people want to post.
Why must everything that happens that involves black and white people be viewed through a racial lens? What does the police officer's race have to do with this incident? There is no indication that the snowballers pelted the Hummer because the driver was black and the cop did not pull his gun because he was black and the crowd was white.
3:48 pm
If the City Paper is going to let people make racist comments on their pages I suggest you do not let them do so anonymously. You should print everyone's e-mail or IP addresses. Maybe then more people would keep a civil tongue in their mouths.
4:13 pm
The only racism I've seen about this issue are the black people defending an out of control black cop against white citizens of the district. I dealt with half a dozen completely racist black neighbors this morning who thought the white and black kids having the snowball fight together should have been shot for "bringing the suburbs to DC." This is pure black hatred against white DC and things white people like to do. No one should think otherwise. It's the black power class trying to shut down the white students who have no power with the force of guns. Mayor Barry IS Bull Connor, not the other way around.
4:29 pm
There have always been police who have not acted lawfully.
Thank God today we have videos to uncover who they are.
Keep the pressure on the police department to remove this man from the police force.
Race is irrelevant in this incident
Detective Baylor should resign from the police force. He's a hot head and will eventually cause an incident ..if he hasn't already.
4:59 pm
>>> If the City Paper is going to let people make racist comments on their pages I suggest you do not let them do so anonymously. You should print everyone's e-mail or IP addresses. Maybe then more people would keep a civil tongue in their mouths.
The underlying threat implied in that comment is precisely how the NKVD and GSP kept public dissent under control in their respective areas. Implied atmosphere of "You are being watched" was just as effective as actually watching people.
Free Speech is Free Speech....it even applies to idiots.
Tamper with that and sooner or later you're the one in the cross hairs.
.
5:17 pm
No one has poised this racial question; if the snow ball throwers were black , would this black detective " act any differently " ? My opinion is " yes " based on my six decades of living in a multi-racial society, the detective would not have overly reacted and certainly would not have pulled his revolver; this man is a racist " time bomb " waiting to explode; actions speak louder than words ! He should be immediately fired from the force !
5:21 pm
Now I realize this is a "wired hipster blogging tweeting twenty-something liberal Lewinsky-type DC kid" story, I wish that cop had started blazing. What a golden opportunity to snuff out several future lobbyists, lawyers, and mainstream media liars.
5:35 pm
I Will Give Up My Snowball When They Peel My Cold Dead Fingers From Around It.
5:45 pm
William raises an interesting point.
5:50 pm
Those who are upset about the calls to fire the detective can thank Jesse Jackson and Fat Al Sharpton for creating this climate.
A white man hiccups in a manner the "reverends" dislike, and those two start screaming for him to lose his job.
Blacks, until you distance yourselves from those money-grubbing, race-baiting mob pimps, you'll have to bear the burden of letting them speak for you.
5:51 pm
Look very carefully at this video starting at the link (35 seconds) and watch until the Detective is hit in the face with a snowball, the thrower jumps with delight and squeals with joy. When they enter from the left at around 37 seconds, they sure look like black faces and black ungloved hands that they pointing at the detective. Again, for 10-20s of this clip, it sure looks like blacks throwing at the black detective.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFC8mNdxV0c#t=35s
5:52 pm
Williams is a genius. Because, you know, young black men are hardly ever shot by older black officers.
5:57 pm
I love all you sons of bitches, because your hate is making me stronger to rule the earth and God or his Angels will not be able to save you. haha
Believe me, the Devil do exists and it's seem in many of your comments with your hate.
6:09 pm
Dear Jason, I am sadden to see such ignorant comments being made in the Washington City Paper, but I support freedom of speech. Continue to let others say or write what they feel in their hearts. I rather deal with a Racist up front than do deal with an undercover Racist on the down low living in Washington, D.C.
The whites who are referring to blacks as monkeys, apes, and niggers, if you don't like D.C. move the fuck back to middle America and have snowball fights there on a farm. You see, not only can blacks, Puerto Ricans, Cubans, Dominicans, Salvadorans, Mexicans, West Indians, etc. can act like "savages". White U.S. citizens can act like "savages" too, but their bad behavior is seen as all American good fun.
Stanley, Martin, M.D.
Native Washingtonian
North Portal Estates
Ward 4 Resident
6:17 pm
As an aside, what a shock that, in a 200+ comment thread, the only comment JC would call out as "interesting" would be a comment that called for a cop to be fired. Never saw that one coming!
6:21 pm
Downtown Rez I don't think the comment I wrote as interesting called for the cop to be fired. It was asking the question: what if all those kids were African American? Would the police response been different?
I found it interesting only in that it made me think about what might have happened: would all those kids have been patted down? Would the three that were signaled out been arrested? Would shots have been fired? Who knows.
That's all. But I still laughed at your comment.
6:33 pm
Sure it did. See:
"...this man is a racist " time bomb " waiting to explode; actions speak louder than words ! He should be immediately fired from the force !"
You never said which part of the comment you found "interesting".
Jason, I've been reading you for years, and IMO you are the most anti-PD reporter I've ever read. So naturally this leapt out.
Just sayin'
6:50 pm
Downtown rez
Any, ANY police officer that draws a gun on a crowd of holiday snowballers should be fired. That isn't anti police. Just common sense.
Is he a racist time bomb? Probably. Blacks perform poorly in most jobs involving high level decision making, so much so that they object to exams as "racist" as the Conn firefighters know well. Black police officers reputation has never recovered from the horror of the New Orleans PD Katrina fiasco where 30% walked off the job and those that did not were caught looting by CNN.
Affirmative Action always shows it flaws during a crisis, though I never thought of a Snowball fight as a crisis. The fact that blacks are jumping on here defending drawing a gun on a snowball fight is a real eyeopener.
Of course they defended the pedophile Michael Jackson.
6:53 pm
@ William - Watch all the video. The crowd was racially mixed. As a matter of fact, it was an African-American that actually struck Baylor with a snowball *after* he exited his vehicle.
FWIW, if I were the guy that Baylor arbitrarily snatched up (who did *not* throw the snowball), I'd file a battery charge.
Other things to consider:
It's reasonable to expect to be pelted with a snowball or two under these circumstances.
I'm sure the snowball fight was clearly visible as Baylor approached the intersection.
Being pelted with a snowball shouldn't be a hazard unless you are driving at an unsafe speed or carelessly.
Driver's (especially trained officers) should be in control of their vehicles and capable of responding safely in the event of a unforseen incident.
A law enforcement officer, especially a veteran, should know that it is inappropriate in draw his weapon under these circumstances.
Baylor got out of his vehicle because he was pissed.
He drew his weapon because he was pissed.
He walked toward the crowd because he was pissed.
He grabbed the innocent guy because he was pissed.
He doesn't have the self-control or good judgement to remain in a position of authority over citizens or to be allowed to carry a lethal weapon.
Fire this guy or at the very least allow him to resign.
Baylor and his like need to go. They have no place in law enforcement.
7:01 pm
One last point, anywhere else in the country where a strange man got out of his car with a gun in his hand screaming and scaring a group of kids would have been shot. Any father defending his kids would have done so. The fact that D.C. does not let regular people exercise their rights to defend themselves from "out of control" persons is sad.
7:19 pm
I lived along the U Street corridor for over 20 years only to move last year because the neighborhood became overrun by a bunch of self-absorbed brats. Overly pampered by their parents, and awarded by educators for even the most marginal performance, lest these precious little darlings lose their sense of self-worth, or not fit in. Shame.
Had this been a group of black neighborhood kids lobbing shit at cars and passersby, these little pussies would have been up in arms.
The little pukes have ruined what was once a wonderful neighborhood. Black, white, gay straight, and then some. Although rough around the edges, we all came together as a unified neighborhood when push came to shove. Five years ago, they wouldn't have dared set foot in the neighborhood, or better yet, take the Green Line.
Perhaps these brats should move back to the suburbs, or, the hick Midwestern town they came from. These dorks even think that Saint Ex is "cool." Such radicals.
I say bring back the draft. I'd love to see this group of losers drafted, and sent to Iraq or Afghanistan so we could let our overburdened men and women that have served multiple tours of duty come home to their families.
And before you send snarky and racist responses. I'm white and I'm a liberal. Grow up already.
7:34 pm
I just got home from shopping and reading some of these stupid comments are just too much.
One the detective was wrong period, if I was the mayor or cheif of police I would take his badge and gun right now and susspend him followed by a hearing to terminate him. We still have due process in this country, LIKE IT OR NOT! This situation did not warrent this action by Det. Baylor.
The crowd was also wrong. With all the parks and open spaces in this town, why 14th and 'U' streets? Where some of these people looking for confrontation?
But the comments here from cop haters and racist blacks are just plain STUPID!
Det. Baylor has authority issues, as view by the tape he dose not like to be told what to do or to be challenged, and this is a very, very dangerous view he has toward people, like many in this police department, a result of putting substandard people with mental issues or a lack of education on the street interacting with the public.
7:43 pm
This is a news article that is being carried in other nations...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/8423705.stm
It is humiliating to America that people are posting racist comments here...but then maybe its better if people in other nations understand more accurately what America is.
A civilized nation would have had a group of policemen come and disperse the crowd (without showing their guns) and recommend they continue their snow ball fight in a park.
richieh You are no liberal.
If you want to moderate this site you could eliminate some racist and incendiary words.
8:00 pm
'colleen' the police officers that arrived later were responding to the call for a reported man (Det. Baylor) with a gun, they did not know that this moron was a police officer. Someone or many called, 911 because Baylor did not I.D. himself as a police officer to anyone plus his reckless behavior didn't help either.
The officers that come in response to the 911 calls did the right thing!
8:03 pm
CORRECTION: Line 7 came, not come.
8:28 pm
What a bunch of idiots! LOL LOL LOL LOL
Reading all the racist comments coming from both whites and blacks have opened my eyes to the racism that exists in the United States and it has saddened me. Most blacks in the U.S. have a white ancestry back to slavery, therefore we are all mixed with other favors besides Caucasian and Negroid. Even some Liberals can be racists too as all of us. It's Christmas, please show some love for your fellow man and woman.
8:28 pm
If your care is being pelted with snowballs how do you know what is going on.
The officer could have believed he was being underattack.
FOP means fraternal order of police by the way.
8:37 pm
What an idiot -- this guy shouldn't be allowed to carry a gun if he pulls it out so easily -- over a snowball fight -- because his ego is bruised. Imagine if someone had done something really serious, like give him a raspberry.
Mr. tough guy. This sort of thing gives good cops a bad name.
Not only that, but he took a harmless situation and made it a dangerous and lifethreatening one.
Jerk.
9:22 pm
I was at the snowball fight. First of all, I admit that snowballs should not have been thrown at cars. However, the bigger mistake was the reaction of the cop. He totally blew his cool and abused the authority he has as a police officer. He is a disgrace to the badge!
9:30 pm
"The underlying threat implied in that comment is precisely how the NKVD and GSP kept public dissent under control in their respective areas. Implied atmosphere of "You are being watched" was just as effective as actually watching people.
Free Speech is Free Speech....it even applies to idiots.
Tamper with that and sooner or later you're the one in the cross hairs."
Until the City Paper starts hailing people away in Black Marias to secret prisons it is absurd to compare suggesting that the City Paper encourage civility by not letting people post hateful comments anonymously with the tactics of the NKVD. Free Speech is not some absolute. It is a restriction on government imposing limits on free speech. It does not mean that a private business like the City Paper must allow people to post racist or homophobic comments anonymously. Plenty of newspapers online remove offensive comments. Some idiot posted an address and phone number online claiming it was the officer's address and number. Should that be permitted under free speech? What if it is the address is for the wrong person? Publishing e-mail addresses would discourage uncivil speech but would not stop it entirely. It would only make people think twice about what they say and make them possibility accountable for what they say. The slippery slope argument is hardly convincing. Free speech on the internet in US is hardly endangered. Civility most certainly is.
9:47 pm
Oh, Colleen. I am a liberal. Yes indeedy.
And to cite the BBC is somewhat naive, to say the least. Especially considering that organizations somewhat sketchy history. Additionally, Europein general has had huge problems over the years with skinheads and other right-leaning subversives, so, to cite the Continent as everything utopian is moot. BTW. Wasn't one of the royals in attendance at a costume party sporting a Nazi uniform and Swastika? Lovely.
By way of background, I was born in the Netherlands, and have had the good fortune to have lived abroad quite a bit, including with dear friends that live abroad. For you to bemoan America as this bastion of racism is also a bit Eurocentric, and again, naive. Hate is everywhere honey.
Considering the fact that Europe has only been held in check since the end of WWII doesn't diminish the fact that the Continent had been at war with each other for centuries. Constantly. And, European colonialism is pretty much the reason that those in the Middle East and elsewhere abhor the West. Lest we forget The Crusades?
Do I think the police detective overreacted? Absolutely. But, I also think it's fair game to lay the cards on the table. If this were a group of African American kids tossing snowballs at passersby...oh never mind...you just don't get it.
So Colleen, perhaps your not as liberal as you'd like to think you are.
10:16 pm
Richieh, I am not a liberal or conservative, but thank you for your wonderful comment. I am glad some people are more rational than the others. I agree, the MPD officer was wrong for pulling out his gun in the matter he did. Hopefuly all parties can learn from this. In the future with Yuppies want to have a snow ball fight, they should go to a park, a farm, or out in the country out of an urban environment. Hope Police Chief Cathy L. Lanier will discipline the MPD detective for his unprofessionalism.
10:22 pm
Correction:
Richieh, I am not a liberal or a conservative, but thank you for your wonderful comment. I am glad some people are more rational than others. I agree, the MPD officer was wrong for pulling out his gun in the manner in which he did. However, all parties can learn from this. In the future, Yuppies who want to have a snow ball fight should go to a park, a farm, or out in the country out of an urban environment. Hopefully, Police Chief Cathy L. Lanier will discipline this MPD detective for his unprofessionalism.
I am tired, because I was out for 3 hours shoveling about 30 inches of snow off my vehicle on today thanks to DPW trucks and Mother Nature.
Native Washingtonian
Ward 4 D.C. Resident
10:59 pm
What a maroon!
Take this "Shaft" character's ego away immediately!
11:10 pm
To anyone that was actually at the snowball fight, how bad was the cop's car hit? Was hit once, ten times?
11:48 pm
The detective was wrong, snow ballers were wrong, THAT'S IT FOR CHRIST SAKE!!!!!!!!!!
12:21 am
I'm from snow and snowball country and totally amazed at some of the comments here. Having watched multiple videos it is quite obvious that this event was all in fun. A means of making a tough day lighter!
Might not be the smartest place to hold a large snowball fight on a street nor totally kewl to include cars as targets but duh, the risk was minimal. Have a sense of humour! An iceball hitting a car travelling at speed might be dangerous. A slushy snowball hitting a car crawling down the road? Give me a break! The kids down our streets greet us with some each time we get a storm. (it being a quiet dead end street, often the driver will stop, toss on the 4 ways and cheerfully toss a ball or two in return!). Comments about poor senior ladies possibly getting hurt? About blocking an emergency road? Again give me a break...these young adults stopped when needed to help push a cop car out of snow. So were taking care of what was around them and acting accordingly! What is wrong with folks wanting to have fun!!! (this opinion is supported it seems by the uniformed cop telling the folks a number of time they can get back to their snowball fight!)
It was also obvious from video that this detective's pride got hit and that at no time had he been at risk. Talk about flying on testoterone and adrenaline and acting in a totally unprofessional manner. The vids make it obvious that it had nothing to do with trying to take charge of a situation he thought risky. We've seen on our own west coast what happens when cops overeact. Don't give this cop a taser!!!! I hope that sufficient complaints are filed so that he is severely disciplined. My advice to those wishing to file complaints is for sure do so. But do so calmly and professionaly if you wish to be heard!
12:59 am
How incredibly disturbing.
According to the CNN report, people were invited to the snowball fight as a somewhat organized neighborhood activity. Photos and videos clearly show that people were helping cars that got stuck and having a generally good time with each other. If the police had concern about the gathering, why did they make no attempt to disperse the crowd earlier? I think because the gathering posed no threat and caused no harm.
I can understand Detective Baylor's (sp?) frustration, but not his reaction if he is someone trained in law enforcement and the proper use of firearms.
But that is not the most disturbing thing to me. What I am most disturbed about right now is how many people posting here have determined to make a racial issue out of this.
True blacks have suffered much more at the hands of police than have whites. Also the photos and videos do show the crowd to be primarily, though not exclusively white. Seems the black and white people in the crowd could get along while engaging in a somewhat aggressive, though apparently not hostile behavior. Why is it that several of the people posting here have to try to turn this into a racial issue? Does anyone honestly believe that people upset by the overreaction of this detective would have not cared about his action had he been white?
2:53 am
i am sorry for my recent posts on this thread . you see, i am not a yuppy . i am a really sick puppy . in fact i am a guppy . i am called guppy because i like to suck on all of the libtarded b.s. that spews forth from what ever long and erect phallucies it cums from . i will defend it to the very end . i don't care when you tell me that the pictures of pretty roses on the floral website i am viewing is really feces on a scat site . i know the truth that pictures of feces on scat sites are truly pictures of roses on floral websites . i do know a turn when i see 1 because i spend most of my getting the white stuff out of the long and fragrant phallusus that belong to the african diversity in my dc . yes i am dc, not ac . i only receive . all whites are put here to receive from the african diversity in these matters . i will suck until there is no white left . in all other areas i give not only what have, but what you have to the the africn diversity . so bend over and give all you have by taking the long fat unlubed dark phallus up your @#$%^& .
3:14 am
Give that man a cheezburger!
http://fuckgrapefruit.wordpress.com/2009/12/21/balls-of-snow/
3:42 am
Here's how I would write the stroy:
Fun-crazed frat-boys, ignore concept of 'consent', terrorize friendly cop with snow projectiles, triggering panic attack. Justice averted when PTSD cop refuses to shoot vacant, spoiled funsters to death. Twitter-holes later whine about police brutality because they saw a gun.
5:28 am
Excellent job of reporting this story. Good for you!!
6:39 am
This guy should be fired. There is no need for that type of hothead in the police force. What is a DC cop doing with a Hummer anyway? How do they afford that? He also seemed pretty well dressed. As for the snowball throwers.. get a life... you have time to Twitter on your cell phone your parents pay for and play like children, but no time to work. Throwing snowballs at cars can cause accidents. Didn't your parents ever teach you that?
6:49 am
Never heard of a gun at a snow ball fight. Why not just use that big hummer as it should be used and drive away. Let the fun continue. The detective should have been checked for alchohol.
9:24 am
If you want to whip snowballs at other people who are up for a snowball fight....more power to you. But the second you start throwing snowballs at passing cars when driving is hazardous enough in those conditions, you're not having harmless fun....you're creating a very dangerous situation that could have very bad consequences. If you fail to see that....you're an absolute idiot. And if the guy didn't want to have snowballs whipped at him, it's certainly not harmless fun to him. He has a right to go about his business without being hit by snowballs. Your failure to respect that right makes you nothing more than a punk.
9:40 am
@Daddy Grace Fish Sandwich- It's been said several times before in this thread: yes, the snowball fight was unruly and possibly unsafe but that cop got out, brandished his weapon and did not identify himself. He is creating a bad image for law enforcement everywhere. Also, the situation did not warrant that kind of deadly force or the threat of it. What the cop was doing was far worse than what the crowd was doing.
10:25 am
@knee gorw (#27)
Go back to Africa? wtf? You americans import people like they are animals to build your economy. Then you want to toss them out like trash? I am so happy I am eurpean. Americans are barbarians. Fat, stupid, TV-addicts.
10:41 am
That's what you get when you have feral jungle apes carrying badges and guns. The crowd should have lynched that filthy spook.
10:56 am
seriously?
Did this fool have no childhood with snowballs? Does he have some traumatizing event in his life that involved snowballs? I know when you get hit in the ear when it has frozen over hurts like hell, but... SERIOUSLY? OVER FRIGGIN SNOWBALLS?
I vote strip him of his ability to carry a gun, he obviously cannot distinguish when to and when not to draw a gun. He threatened many people, grabbed a random person to accuse. The people were having good clean fun in the SNOW. FFS I hate the idiots on this world. More and More everyday this world is becoming more like the movie Idiocracy. Hell, after watching and him crying about his precious chinese owned Hummer I don't blame Hunter S. Thompson anymore..
11:12 am
More freedoms slowly being taken away. We should rise up and over throw this craptastic rule of law and wipe it clean and start over. Everyone who joins.. black.. white.. asain.. mexican.. whoever.. will come out together as one. Thus ending this racism, ending this tyranny and creating a new world for us all to enjoy in peace.
11:34 am
This doesnt surprise me at all. Here is another case of a public figure (one who is entrusted with protecting lives) that believes he can do anything and get away with it. Everyone in DC should protest this nutcase being allowed to keep his job. Clearly he is on the edge and the city should lock him up. If it was anyone else they would be in jail. Every police agency has an Internal Affairs Dept. If they wont investigate this then what will they investigate?? Again, EVERY PEACE LOVING CITIZEN in DC needs to protest to get this scum off the street. He is a threat (made terrorist theats on the public) and a liability to all.
12:01 pm
Call 800.298.4006 (DC internal affairs) to demand
firing of this gun crazed cop. Request complaints to be forwarded to Chief Kathy Lanier.
He should be charged with reckless endangerment and aggravated assault.
Jack C.
Atlanta
12:17 pm
Hats off to Puzzled Canadian for comment #216. What good sense. I personally think the appropriate sanction for Officer Baylor is to be fired. A man with such a short temper should not be allowed to have a gun.
As an American with friends and acquaintance from overseas this incident and the comments here are quite embarrassing and reinforces the stereotype many people in the world have of Americans as being trigger happy and racists. It is amazing that a playful snowball fight can lead to a cop pulling a gun and all the racist who read the the City Paper come scurrying out of their sewers to make ignorant racist comments. Despite President Obama's election racism is a wound on America that has just scabbed over. Pick at it a bit and the wound is still fresh.
1:05 pm
So hilarious. An officer pulls a gun on but doesn't fire on a bunch of white overgrown frat boys and sorority girls who whipped snowballs at him while he was driving and it's "outrageous" and "he should have his badge taken away" and oh the humanity, etc. Black people have to get shot at least thirty times while reaching for their wallet for someone to raise a similar outcry. Meanwhile all of these yuppie losers are back at their desk jobs on K Street regaling a captive audience about their "run-in" with the "5-0" this weekend; I know because I've been listening to it all morning.
1:10 pm
ADDITION TO RESPONSE #231
Crazed cop should also be charged with intimidation and terrorist threats. This cop is a DOMESTIC TERRORIST/
Call 800.298.4006 (DC internal affairs) to demand
firing of this gun crazed cop. Request complaints to be forwarded to Chief Kathy Lanier.
1:29 pm
Quoute "Cops on radio say Det is being 'blackmailed'"
The real radio message played in the last 10 seconds of the full video is "Det. Baylor would be black male in his ....." The uniformed officer responded gun draw because of gun drawn call. You can see when the call comes in Baylor listens to his radio and puts his gun away. He assaulted people in the street / failed to identify himself / threatened people. What punishment will he get? Desk duty? Suspended with pay? Psych eval? I know if a civilian did those things there would be server response. Why does a hot-headed detective walk away with nothing but appearent cover ups.
1:44 pm
The sad part about this snowball case is that these so-called "kids" were not kids. They were grown adults. They were not even afraid of a man with a gun. These people just stood there taunting this man. It just goes to show you how stupid some of today's so-called young adults, just don't have a clue. A bullet has no name on it, and a cop probably is a better shot, than the average thug. If it were me I would have ran away, but these idiots just stood there like a deer caught in the headlights. How sad when a man's race, and choice of car is a problem. Please, anyone with good credit can get a Hummer. Maybe these snow-ballers can not aford to get a Hummer, and they were just plain jealous.
1:53 pm
The sheer racism on this thread is absolutely heartbreaking. I'd like to think most of the truly hateful comments were left by one or two tasteless trolls with too much time on their hands, but I'm probably being far too optimistic.
As more level-headed posters have already said, the snowball fighters (who appear to have been primarily but not exclusively white) chose a poor venue for their activities, and they definitely shouldn't have been throwing snowballs at moving vehicles.
That being said, the bulk of the fault here lies with Detective Baylor, who handled the situation terribly. What he should have done was show his badge, calmly reprimand the people having the snowball fight for throwing things at cars, and tell them to move to a park. Remember, it's his JOB to accurately assess what constitutes "reasonable force" in any given situation, and respond with the minimum degree of force necessary. If he does have to draw his gun -- and in this case, he really, really didn't -- he should know to immediately identify himself as a police officer. A police officer who waves his gun around at a friendly snowball fight without identifying himself needs to be put on desk duty until he's gone through some sort of remedial training.
Was race an exacerbating factor in this confrontation? Certainly Detective Baylor's display of excessive force and the outraged derision of the crowd may have been driven by underlying racial tensions, although I can't speculate on individual motivations. But race politics aside, this is a clear instance of a police officer behaving badly. Police abuse of force is hardly an uncommon phenomenon, and a mismanaged snowball fight pales beside more extreme examples (cf. Amadou Diallo, Abner Louima, Rodney King), but this is no excuse for Detective Baylor's actions. He doesn't deserve a free pass simply because his misconduct fell short of flagrant abuse of civil rights.
For what it's worth, my (admittedly limited) personal experience suggests that police officers of all races are disproportionately likely suffer from a whole suite of unfortunate personality traits: poor anger management, arrogance, a need to exert power. I suspect that people with these issues are drawn to the profession, and the insular, faux-military nature of police culture shields them from accountability until they really overstep the line.
3:39 pm
@echizenkurage: Allow me to clarify my remarks. I don't believe that the officer's response was at all appropriate. I also don't, however, believe that a bunch of jackhole adult children who chose to throw snowballs at a moving vehicle and then followed it up with playground chants have any right to paint themselves as victims of police brutality (yes, some of them have been using that phrase) when we have seen far too many examples of what real police brutality looks like.
4:18 pm
I concurr echizenkurage.
For all of the contempt you'd think Baylor shot a couple of them. I believe the detective drew his weapon after discussion and snowballs thrown at him when he turned his back.
They pull guns in the hood for far less.
That said, he surely could have more calmly assessed the situation and turned the snowballers away from their more illegal activities (vehicular traffic).
4:21 pm
Facts...not trying to be racist.
Blacks are 39 times more likely to commit a violent crime against a white than vice versa, and 136 times more likely to commit robbery.
Although blacks make up approximately 13% of the US population, in 2005 blacks accounted for 49% of the new HIV/AIDS diagnoses.
Black women are nearly 20 times more likely to have HIV/AIDS than white women.
4:21 pm
Oh yeah...in case its not obvious, Yuppy #218 was tag theft.
4:35 pm
In most countries the government is afraid if the prople;
in the US the sheeple are afraid of the government....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XncuY4wLaA8
4:36 pm
Odin,
What's the percentage of whites descended from over 400 years of forced uncompensated labor, forced family and culture separation, property deprivation, and forced illiteracy all supported by 'their' government even though they defended it in every one of its wars?
What is the percentage of whites that live in impoverished population dense areas after that horrid past?
What's the percentage of whites who survived all of that and became leaders in their respective professions?
...just curious.
4:46 pm
@Odin
Fact: those sorts of statistics can be skewed so easily that they are essentially irrelevant.
Fact: you keep those numbers handy for some reason.
Fact: you're a racist.
4:53 pm
@odin
<-- totally called that one.
4:55 pm
Hey Yuppy or is it Guppy ? Was that a Maryland or a DC tag that was stolen at 218 ?
5:13 pm
...er...uh...I provided NO statistics or numbers. I asked them of you. So when you say...
"Fact: those sorts of statistics can be skewed so easily that they are essentially irrelevant.
Fact: you keep those numbers handy for some reason."
...then I have to ask about what do you speak?
Every statistic MUST be considered in context. You provided selected seemingly one-sided statistics. I offered context.
Your reason for offering the one-sided statistics suggests bias though you claimed you weren't "...trying to be racist." Apparently, it was effortless. You were certainly being racial if not racist.
Americans are of every ethnicity, culture, and ancestry. Each is an individual. No two of them are alike, despite how willing we/you are to group and denigrate them.
I think it behooves us Americans to do our part to improve OUR society in every way possible which would include reducing ALL crime, AIDS, education, health, the environment, etc.
I work and play with people of all hues and origins without discrimination and challenge others in that regard.
5:16 pm
Tell Chief Lanier to fire the motherf#@ker @ 800-298-4006
5:17 pm
We've removed a lot of comments that are just racist ranting having nothing to do with the post. Feel free to rant on your own blog.
5:38 pm
Excellent move LL. Thank you for having these hateful comments removed.
6:13 pm
This would be funny if not so sad.
The wealth of United States of America was built upon the backs and lives of African slaves. This isn't China, Ireland, Russia, or ancient Roman. The human capital of American slave labor and its Jim Crow extensions created and sustained this nation from its infancy to just a few decades ago.
WE/YOU benefit from that despite your ignorance. History didn't begin this morning. How many of your American ancesters were lynched? How might your family deal with the powerlessness of such a trajedy? Did your grandparents own a business? They were able to do so. Were they able to go to school or, like mine, self teach after tending someone else's fields as sharecroppers descended from slavery?
That you use terms like "OUR reparations", "blacks...fuss and whine", "handouts", and "whitey" only speak to your lack of objectivity. That speaks to the potential hopelessness of our society more than any of your out-of-context rhetoric and generalizations.
Do you even know how much funding has gone to the many nations of Africa, themselves also just decades out of colonialism (read that: forced theft of land, resources, and labor). Trillions...you think that, really? Regardless, Africa is not America.
You sound like Rush and Hannity who are simply paid haters.
There is and always has been a population of white supremists who have fought and continue to fight (behind the scenes) at every turn the allowance of non-whites into their American society.
Whites created welfare which served to further encourage removing men from households thus breaking up the family ethic. You see the results. I don't suggest that was the intended outcome, but it sure did happen.
Supremists have been fighting equality in the military, educational opportunities, home and business ownership, etc. for centuries. Then, like you, they point out how bad blacks are as if history started this morning.
For what its worth, I am a black man, age 50, whose family has never been on welfare and who has worked since the age of 15. I never mentioned reparations but believe that the discussion is worth having in light of the needs of OUR SHARED SOCIETY.
I'll stop here by asking you to crank your mind open a notch or two and imagine that your FOX-like conclusions might be void of facts and understanding of YOUR FELLOW HUMAN BEINGS.
Please stop being a hater.
6:56 pm
Wait, the cop was black? Shame on the mob of angry hipsters. They feel so entitled and did in fact act wrong. If someone says stop they should stop - cop or not. And the officer was very dark so they clearly could see him in the snowy conditions.
Double standards again and racist whites making fun of a hard working detective.
Shame on them!
6:59 pm
Just watched the video on youtube. Thought it was the white officer at first. Now this whole story makes a little more sense.
DC is a horrible city.
7:43 pm
So it appears that Detective Baylor has lost control once again. It's not surprising - search for his name and "Tanesha Hopkins" and you'll (sadly) not be surprised as his previous behavior.
It's only a matter of time before this man kills someone again and then blames anyone other than himself. When will MPD take steps to clean house? The time for this is well overdue.
8:13 pm
Denis:
Could you post a link to these incidents that you are referencing?
Can't seem to find it.
9:46 pm
won't obama have this lunatic and somebody at random to have irish coffee by the fireplace?
10:04 pm
First of all, "a friendly snowball fight" is an OXYMORON. I am a white police officer and many times white officers have drawn their weapons on blacks for just hanging around. That doesn't get national news coverage or outrage on shows that show this. Let's state facts:
There was a crowd of people throwing snowballs at 14th and U Street, N.W.
They pelted a motorist with snowballs.
Snowballs can be a dangerous projectile.
He took action to protect his life and property.
End of story. The perils of gentrification. Yawn.
10:41 pm
Some of you racist Demons need to go back to school and learn how to spell and write a complete sentence in English. Easy Rider is a good example. Dam idiot! He will be in "hell" with me soon.
11:02 pm
Arrest all of them. Confiscate their gloves. Bring all of the snow to the police station for it will be used as evidence.
11:39 pm
This message is to SATAN.
If you really believe this cop is completely not at fault and innocent, you more than just dumb... You are stupid (and you can't fix stupid)...Have fun calling other people "not being able to spell" and not "able to write complete sentences," but you are absolutely "retardedly stupid" (and yes, i made that up) and have a college degree....Whether you are white or black, he should be fired and in jail.
11:51 pm
if it had been a white cop,he would be dead.
12:02 am
Allen, I am not a mortal. I am "Satan". Some called me other names like Lucifer, the Devil, etc. I am not defending the Cop's actions, because he too will be coming to live in "hell" with me.
Allen, I can assure you, there's no discrimination in "hell". Many of your asses will burn in "hell".
The Devil
12:16 am
Well had the officer Identified himself and or displayed a badge, waving a GUN is permitted but because HE DIDN'T is every reason he shall be thrown off the force. He failed to call into dispatch that he was indeed on scene, call came out as a person's with GUN, nothing mentioned of an officer on scene.
I am waiting for the conclusion of this, I wonder what President has to say about this???
12:26 am
Well "SATAN", you are simply trying to get a rise out of any person you can. Try to come up with something other than race next time... This cop was in the wrong
12:46 am
I think there is a lesson to be learned for all parties involved. Baylor is the more guilty psrty, but the snowballers were no saints for what they did. Lets just hope that everyone learned a lesson from this.
5:20 am
The actions on the part of the hooligans were in Direct violation of a Crime statute in the DC against throwing Objects & missiles into the street. Yet nothing is being done to the hooligans who organized this Unlawful Assembly and created the disturbance in the first place. On the Huffington Post website & Reason.Tv a woman named Lacey Macauley seems too be one of the key organizers of this incident. This incident should NOT have been in the middle of the street, hitting vehicles, obstructing traffic and general lawlessness. The community needs to organize events in a park, and inform Police and file for a permit before doing such STUPID things. The persons who organized this should be arraigned and held responsible for the disruption that "they alone" caused. There is enough Video out there to Identify people.
5:52 am
There should be laws that prevents anyone from screwing with a moving car. Throwing snowballs, rocks, or other items at moving vehicles can scare the hell out of the driver if they don't expect it. The road is not a plaything, and a startled driver can easily lose control. While some snow in the car or face seems harmless, so too is a pinch on a girls butt. But both are considered a type of aggrivated assault. I think snowball adults needed to get a ticket and be redirected to a park.
6:55 am
Det. Baylor made a very big mistake. He failed to shoot everyone that was throwing snowballs. Thats actually considered aggrevated assault and on a police officer. Everyone of the dumbasses should have got some lead in their ass.
8:25 am
How does a cop afford a Hummer?
9:11 am
You are defacing an innocent man’s character “Elmer Baylor”. He is NOT the detective that performed this act. It is Michael Baylor. If diligent research was performed you would have realized there are two detectives on the department.
9:19 am
DESK DUTY MY ASS....
Baylor should have arrested and Chief Lanier should have fired Baylor on the f#@king spot.
Pull a gun in DC and see what happens to YOU!!
Now let's tell the mayor what you think of this chicken shit response.
http://app.dc.gov/apps/about.asp?page=atd&type=dsf&referrer=$DSF_SERVER_NAME$&agency_id=1075
9:20 am
@ MPD White Official
Wow, Nazi much?
Americans have the RIGHT TO ASSEMBLE you idiot. It's in the Constitution? Ever heard of it? I can't even believe you said that. Detective Baylor should be fired and have felony charges filed against him.
Since when, in America, do you have to notify the police department and file for a permit to have a freaking SNOWBALL FIGHT????
I can't believe some of the comments on here condoning this. If you want a police state, and to be arrested because a cop is having a bad day, then I sincerely hope you pack up and leave this country.
9:25 am
I think it was wrong what that cop did. But that racist stuff got to stop knee grow tryin to put ur name as a racial slur. If u want them to go back to Africa buy their tickets. Your people brought them over here in the first place. So take them back. Racist trash. I hate racism. Your kind do it the most. You guys messed this country up enough its about time a man of color cleaned up every thing. Chuck Norris is cool though!
9:31 am
@ Omi
How does a cop afford a Hummer?
Graft and extortion
9:49 am
It seems that the City Paper has copied comments I have read in the Washington Post, but changed the names to make it look like they are commenting "in the city paper." This appears to be PLAGIARISM by the City Paper.
It also seems that the people here have a problem with Blacks in AUTHORITY positions. Note: All the comments about the vehicle he was driving, how he could afford it,
Its a gas guzzler, etc. So What?
Your posters and the city paper need to quit taking comments from the Post & copying them to the city Paper..don't you people have any journalistic morals?
10:18 am
He's just lucky that some law-abiding citizen didn't shoot him. He looked like a lunatic.
10:44 am
@Just joe
"an unruly mob fighting amid the traffic in the middle of the city street"
-That was actually just some kids having a snowball fight. You know, as in S-N-O-W-B-A-L-L-S!
"brave officer" entered the crowd alone and without backup.
-He wasn't that brave, he whipped out his gun before even assessing the situation! Besides, there was no 'crowd' and the only thing he 'entered' was the lane he left his penis-extender illegally parked in....
"Whether you believe a person is an officer or a thug, when he brandishes the weapon he is in charge"
-an unidentified man in civilian clothing waving a gun in public is a PUBLIC THREAT and would be shot dead by any reasonable, gun-carrying civilian
11:06 am
Steve I saw 15 Videos over at Huffington Post, there were people on the curb, in the street, running at each other like a Braveheart Movie or something.
With the snow you couldn't tell if they were throwing snowballs or rocks. 14th & U streets isn't a Movie Set or a Park. The Organizers of this should be rounded up & put in JAIL. They caused the whole thing !
11:11 am
Why don't you taunt the Secret Service down at Lafayette Park during the next snowstorm. All you brave Wannabees?
Cause the Secret Service who is largely White will Arrest your but & put you in JAIL!
All this talk about color is BS. The Snowball people who organized this or Twittered this whole snowball fight at a public street should be thrown in jail. It will teach them a valuable lesson.
12:51 pm
@ William G.
I didn't mention a thing about race, William, and I don't care what color the guy was that pulled a gun, the bottom line is this is the United States of America, and I'm sick of having people like you condone this type of behavior from police officers.
It was a peaceful snowball fight. If you think the use of deadly force (the ONLY reason a police officer should EVER draw there weapon) should be authorized to shut down a snowball fight?
Then please, do us all a favor, move to China.
1:16 pm
@ Yuppy:
>>They pull guns in the hood for far less.
When I read this, it occurred to me that differing attitudes towards guns might be part of the reason the incident escalated to the extent that it did. A veteran police officer in DC is probably going to regard a gun as a tool of the trade, just another part of his day-to-day existence. (Yes, police officers probably understand just how much damage that guns can do better than most other people, but I imagine that at least some police officers get jaded anyway -- as the saying goes, familiarity breeds contempt.)
On the other hand, if the snowball-throwers-turned-protesters had the same sort of suburban, liberal, upper-middle-class upbringing that I did, they grew up with zero exposure to guns and were taught to avoid them like the plague. (Personally, my brother and I weren't allowed to have toy guns when we were kids. My parents refused to buy them, anyone who might give us presents was informed of the no-gun policy. The only exception was water guns, and even those couldn't look like the real thing: my water "gun" was shaped like a seahorse, and my brother's was shaped like an alligator. My sense is that the whole "no toy guns" approach to parenting is pretty common in suburbia. I think the idea is sound -- America would be a better place if more people wanted nothing to do with guns -- although the parents who refuse to buy their kids toy guns but let them play graphically violent video games are kind of missing the point. And yes, I've met people like this - but I digress.)
Anyhow, I think that if somebody of any race pulled a gun on me, I would be absolutely, quaking-in-my-boots, peeing-in-my-pants terrified. And if, sometime before that initial rush of adrenaline wore off, I found out that the person holding that gun was a police officer (and therefore unlikely to haul off and shoot me if I mouthed off) . . . well, I'd go from pissing myself to just plain *pissed* pretty quickly, and I'd probably say some very unpleasant things once I go there.
Of course, all this assumes that the "protesters" had roughly the same experience with and attitudes towards guns that I do. And even if some of the individuals chanting and jeering were motivated by an ingrained belief that guns are dangerous/bad/wrong, the crowd was, I think, primarily driven by a collective resentment of authority (partially justified, and partially the product of unexamined entitlement). Mob mentality almost certainly played a part - and, as I said before, it's likely that for some individuals, racism (unconscious or otherwise) was also a factor. (Certainly, a great many people on this thread immediately perceived the incident as being fundamentally about race.)
Ironically, the snidely antagonistic response of the snowball throwers -- namely, their on-the-spot "protest" and open display of anti-police sentiment -- may have been to some extent informed by the historical canonization of the African American civil rights movement. At some point during their primary education, most of the twenty-something "protesters" in that crowd were taught to acknowledge the civil rights activists of the 50's and 60's as American heroes (and rightly so). It's no surprise that when the opportunity arose, these young adults were eager to mimic the outward form of the civil rights movement (e.g., group protest, non-violent resistance of police authority). Unfortunately, they couldn't be bothered to put their heroic tactics to the service of an equally heroic cause, but such is the way of things: truly heroic causes often require some measure of sacrifice. Or, put in more cynical terms, the "protesters" were attempting to coopt the perceived moral authority of victimhood, while avoiding the messy business of actually being victims.
. . . none of which changes the fact that Detective Baylor acted rashly, dangerously, and in violation of police standards. His actions are currently under review, and rightly so. Still, Detective Baylor's poor response to the situation was his and his alone. I find the group response to the situation more interesting, because it reflects a set of shared values and a collective decision-making process.
1:32 pm
He should be fired immediately without pay. Some of us that were in the crowd are speaking to lawyers regarding a potential lawsuit against the police force should they not punish him accordingly. There's only one solution for his punishment and that is to fire him immediately for endangering the lives of others and abusing the privilege of carrying a weapon.
On another note, we are also going to be filing a separate lawsuit against the detective himself.
2:51 pm
If this group were an all black group, the same people out there on Sunday would have called the police and the Third District would have shown up to dispurse the crowd of blacks or arrested them. This is sad, but very true. When young college educated whites conduct in this type of behavior, it's seen as having fun. If the crowd were all young college on non college educated blacks, they would have been treated differently by MPD and others living in that community in Ward 1.
The MPD police officer was wrong for pulling his weapon and he should be dicipline by Police Chief Cathy L. Lanier.
3:37 pm
I read as many neighborhood
message boards as I can to get a full scope of the city. Over on the east side
people are wondering how a group of "yuppies" got away with committing this kind
of crime, posted it on the internet and got so much fame for doing something so
dangerous. It is clear that they are questioning whether or not it would have
been totally different had the yuppies been a group of black teens.
Two days ago when we finally got out in the snow, a bit of snow fell from a tree
and landed on my windshield and scared me half to death. I thought about the
officer. Saturday, while snow was still falling heavily in blizzard conditions,
when visibility was very low, a group of "yuppies" decided to host a snowball
fight on opposite sides of a very busy intersection, hitting cars. Yes, they
had their lattes and they assisted a few people whose cars became disabled, but
let us please stop trying to make this look so cute and innocent because it was
stupid! They could have caused some serious accidents, startled some senior
citizens and gotten a whole group of innocent bystanders killed if they had hit
the wrong car. Read the paper, there are some viscious people in this city who
would have thought nothing of spraying the area with bullets for something like
that. All the media keeps saying the guy brought a gun to a snowball fight. 1)
He was probably leaving work in a car he earned (sorry yuppies, not just wealthy
people can afford hummers, like some keep implying), 2) He did not receive the
invite to the snowball fight, he was forced into it against his will, and 3) no
matter how cute and cuddly anyone tries to make it, these actions were careless
and dangerous.
Lisa
5:03 pm
Racist white thugs see well dressed african american driving a hummer decided to pelt vehicle with snow balls.
Witnesses said that anarchist klansmen attacked this african american with rocks in snow balls. Witnesses heard white racist scream FU the negro. No whites were pelted by snow balls and were even helped out of the intersection. DC is know to harbor white racists who hate the black men.
9:34 pm
While the officer may have acted in haste, I understand his feelings. You're trying to drive, the roads are slippery, people are all around and they're hitting your car with snowballs which obstructs your vision. What if he had lost control of the car and driven into the crowd? Would that be better?
If these guys wanted to have a snowball fight so badly, why not find a park to do it in. Or better yet why not march down to the White house and have a snowball fight in front of it? See how long that would have been allowed before riot officers came on the scene.
No one's saying you cant have fun, but these people should have used their heads. Cars should not have been targeted at all. If I'm driving and there's a snowball fight and people are throwing snowballs at the cars, I would have called 911. All it takes is one neatly packed hard compact snowball to smash a window. All it takes is having your front window hit to cause you to become distracted. All it takes is distraction to lose control of your car. At that point all it takes is standing infront of an out of control car to possibly lose your life.
9:42 pm
And they're saying that some of the participants in the snowball fight are considering filing lawsuits. Really? Don't you need permits or something to hold large gatherings or public meetings or public events? And given that this was being heavily promoted online, perhaps I should file lawsuits against all those who twittered about it for exposing myself and my children who were only trying to get home that day, to bodily harm. A snowball may be a snowball, but if it hits a 2 year old square in the face and causes a bruise, I consider it a weapon. If it makes said 2 year old fall and smash their head on the sidewalk, then it's a really bad weapon and the person who threw it just assaulted my 2 year old. Now I am eagerly awaiting those lawsuits against the detective, so that I know who to name in my own personal injury lawsuit.
9:53 pm
The Cop should be FIRED.
He would have if he lived in Boston and was white!
RIGHT OBAMA!
2:28 am
Throwing a snowball at someone, anyone, is assault. Throwing one at a total stranger or a total stranger's car is assault and stupidity. Throwing it at a police officer's car is assault, stupidity and really bad luck.
You want to have a friendly snowball fight, go ahead, but do it on private property, not a crowded public street in a major city.
Everyone that threw a snowball at any car or non-participant should have been rounded up, thrown in a paddywagon, and charged with assualt. The cop in question may have overreacted, but he didn't shoot anyone, and the situation was not of his own making.
The burden of fault for this incident belongs overwhelmingly upon those that were throwing the snowballs, not the cop that was being assaulted. I find it shocking that anyone would claim otherwise.
The notion that it was ok because "all Hummers were hit" or "the snowballs were soft" is logically indefensible.
5:02 am
this is what you get when a bunch of stupid white people act like fools.the police should have broken this thing up before it got out of hand..but when white people do things like this it its ok.and this is not the frist time a bunch of imature white people have caused a problem...i dont like being around them..this officer should have kept going
6:37 am
Why all the racist talk here? White, black, green, yellow, whats the ffing difference? It was a cop out of line, with people throwing snowballs at cars and civilians who didnt ask to be in the fight. A snowball to the head can actually be quite painful. The detective was out of line, and the people throwing snowballs should do it in a park and stop pestering passersby. However, threat of assault with a deadly firearm stills ranks higher on the scale of idiocy than throwing snowballs.
3:43 pm
and i quote: "...Lazy tactics prop up lazy arguments. I think we can all agree that throwing a snowball at an armed man--cop or otherwise--is dumb as fuck. It's a reckless, arrogant, stupid act that endangers you and everyone in the vicinity. I think we can also agree that yelling "Fuck you pig!" or some such is the kind of thing that makes those of us who live in fear of the police chafe. Lastly, I think, for black people, and especially those of us who've had friends killed by the cops, it's particularly grating to be confronted with the fact that we live under different rules.
But that said, an argument about who was "the bigger idiot" is really beside the point. One idiot lacks home training. The other idiot lacks professional training. One idiot is a dumb-ass kid. But the other idiot is a salaried, pensioned employee of the state, whose job specifically entails not acting like an idiot. One idiot thinks he's empowered to throw snowballs at cops. The other idiot is, as a matter of law, empowered to throw hot-ones. One idiot might ruin your Hummer. The other idiot might ruin your life--and then go to work the next day.
They aren't the same, and soft-peddling the act of drawing a gun in snowball fight in hopes of spiting some stupid kid, is the kind of dumb-ass tribalism that ultimately hurts the tribe. D.C. is a majority black city, and this guy has been on the force for over a decade. If he's acting as he was--on camera--toward a group of predominantly white kids, imagine how he's acted toward black kids over the years. Imagine how he'll act towards your kids in the future."
2:30 pm
1. Endangered the life of himself and others. Many people including myself conceal carry firearms. Had I been there, I would have shouted for him to put the gun down, shown my intention to disable him, shoved him to the ground to ziptie him awaiting uniformed and badged police presence. If any of those steps had gone sour, and life limb or eyesight of myself or others had become endangered I'd have ensured I had a clear backstop, sight picture and quickly won his heart and mind with two in the heart and one in the mind.
2. ROE... Rules of Engagement. The first concept is to preserve the overall peace. Angrily Jumping out of your car to escalate tension with or without a firearm doesn't preserve the peace nor does it serve himself or the community as the video's portray.
3. Battery is a criminal offense involving unlawful physical contact, distinct from assault in that the contact is not necessarily violent.
Assault is a crime of violence against another person. Assault may refer only to the threat of violence caused by an immediate show of force. Assault is often defined to include not only violence, but any physical contact with another person without their consent.
So throwing snowballs, is battery, whereas holding a gun with intent to shoot, is a whole different ballgame, he brought the threat of violence to the picture. Grabbing people out of a crowd and dragging them to his car is pathetic, and pushing people onto the sidewalk is just as unlawful. The only option of defense the 'people' now had was to escalate to firearms themselves, but oh wait.. the 2nd amendment doesn't apply in DC.
4. . His unwillingness to identify himeslf as a police officer, to include his credentials, just seethes as corruption. THE FOP on his license plates doesn't mean he is above the law, and I see too many FOP tags complete illegal acts where no one is held accountable. Just as for us driving is a privledge not a right.
4. The Dectective has shown the inclination to walk away from the citizens under his protection, without leaving any identifiable information about himself and the crime he had committed.
5. (Not Verified) Works and Lives in DC with vehicle registered in Maryland. Here is the website...
If you live in the District for 30 days or more and operate a vehicle in public space, DC law requires you to obtain a District of Columbia Driver's license, unless you are eligible for reciprocity (students, military, members of Congress, government appointee, diplomats).
Another example of this Detective being above the law.
6. As for the snowballers, good for them, to instantly making everyone aware that the man in the hummer has a gun, this gave those the chance to take cover and/or walk away. Good call on the 911 calls, the videotaping, and the newsmedia blitz. This is not the hero I want kicking in my door in the middle of the night only to realize the wrong door was kicked in.
7. Intermittent explosive disorder (abbreviated IED) is a behavioral disorder characterized by extreme expressions of anger, often to the point of uncontrollable rage, that are disproportionate to the situation at hand. It is currently categorized in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders as an impulse control disorder. IED belongs to the larger family of Axis I impulse control disorders listed in the DSM-IV-TR, along with kleptomania, pyromania, pathological gambling, and others. Impulsive aggression is unpremeditated, and is defined by a disproportionate reaction to any provocation, real or perceived.
All that talk of namecalling is senseless. The detective is a human being just as I am. He violated my trust in the position that he holds and for that my voice will be heard.
I emplore each of you to write the Mayor on this one, create a well crafted letter to the editor, and drop the victimology already.
I'd much rather be standing up in court saying I threw a snowball at a hummer, than standing up in court saying I jumped out of the car and waived my gun at all the pedestrians.
Namaste
10:20 pm
WTF! This is exactly why negroes shouldn't be trusted with any authority! Oh yeah, big bad Jig pulls his gun on kids throwing snow balls! What's his defense? The snow balls gonna gib him frostbite? Please!
9:20 am
Micheal Compton appears to be an associate of the detective who pulled the gun. From any viewpoint or background you cannot truly believe that pulling a gun to stop a snow ball fight was the correct action of a trained law enforcement. The detective appears to be unstable and should not be allowed to carry a gun for professional or personal use. He is a hazard to the community. If action is not taken, he is likely to kill someone and then we will all be talking about we missed all the signs. I suspect the detective gas a history of abuse to others.
6:07 pm
He was probably listening to gangsta rap in his hummer and got all worked up. hahaha. Dumb fuck.
10:05 am
thanks for comment. a good text. very good.
5:14 pm
How does a "poor" cop come to own a Hummer in the first place? Been taking some kickbacks?
1:52 pm
That detective is a moron. He should not be in police work. That gun could have fallen, gone off my mistake. etc. He could have been threatened by the number of people of whatever and it could have escalated. He is an absolute idiot for pullig his weapon and I hpe he loses his job for that. I would not want hin out on the streets.
12:57 pm
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4:26 pm
Let's be clear. Wasn't there a woman in the news who got jail time for throwing a cup of crushed ice into someone's car...a few years back? The cop was wrong as all get out...but the snowballers were supposed to be grown, law-abiding citizens, right?
Hitting someone with a projectile is assault. Hitting someone's property (the cop's car) while he clearly was a consenting participant in the snowball fight = vandalism.
The fact that the cop checked himself enough to keep the body count down to 0...priceless. Those naive, little pissants are alive only by the grace of God. If that had been a drug dealer's Hummer--instead of a cop--we would have read about a multiple fatalities from a drive-by shooting following a "fun snowball fight" at 14th & U Sts NW. They're also lucky that a card-carrying member of the NRA (from outside of DC, WHERE some people can legally own guns) wasn't the one who got bitch-slapped with a snowball, while driving with a loaded firearm in the vehicle.
The cop and the snowballers were idiots, regardless of the races of the parties involved, but the snowballers need to get better acquainted with Jesus, Mohammed, Buddha, or somebody else really, really soon...because their decision-making skills [like those of the cop] may get them killed in another situation.
4:27 pm
CORRECTION: The cop was NOT a consenting participant in the snowball fight
8:41 pm
A cousin told me about this story, and I thought he was making it up. I starting searching for more information online, and came across this article; unbelievable.
Can't we all just get along? Seriously.
4:03 am
Fuck!!! Black cops=over powered
9:19 pm
the new Mortal Kombat Rebirth video came out today, check it out for sure!